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2470 Views 21 Replies Latest reply: Jan 11, 2013 9:46 AM by rlbl RSS
Out Apprentice 872 posts since
Dec 18, 2011

Aim Assist your thoughts

Posted by Out on Jan 10, 2013 5:01 AM

its been 2 months (almost) since the game has been released,  and i would like your thoughts on aim assist (in the options menu)

 

Here is what i have noticed when it is turned on

 

If i am running and gunning, camping, patroling slowly or whatever........if Lag does not seem to be an issue to me or at least me not being on the bad side of the lag ...... i cant tell that helps or hurts my gameplay ..........and i have played with it enabled and disabled .....i could tell no difference in my kills..or not enough to consider anyway....other than head shots are harder to get with it off

 

BUT

when i was on the bad side if the lag ....Aim Assist seems to make the game play worse, when i ADS and start to fire my weapon My weapon will always pull to the right just a little.......i would say the distance from my point of view is about the width of the player ......my shots miss the target and i die

 

so i played around with Aim Assist using several different weapons and  sights / optics from none to the MMS  and just went prone (camping)  the only button i had pressed was the ADS  and i ADSed at a spot where i new players would normally be when they can into sight .....with no other buttons being used i would see my cross hairs or sight move that little bit to the right ........it is odd that it never pulls to the left ....and i know i havent touched the joy stick in any way

 

I am assuming that Lag compensation TRIES to assume where that player will be in the next millisecond and Aim Assist tries to put and keep me on target based on that assumption

 

what are your thoughts on aim assist and do you normally use it or not

2470 Views     
  • HeadHurts Newbie 61 posts since
    Dec 16, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated
    HeadHurts     Jan 10, 2013 5:29 AM (in response to Out)

    HA Aim ass-is-it, does not work for me. I can lay down on ANY map and watch guys run/walk in front of me and my sight doesn't even flicker.Even when I'm moving around and ADS nothing. Since I have been playing aim assist has not worked. I can go into a custom game and it's an immediate lock on. I wish I had the deadly aim that EVERYONE I go up against has. I've watched kill cam after kill cam and EVERYONE can lock on to me and keep there sights on me where as I'm hoping to at least keep my sights center mass.

  • rlbl Master 6,204 posts since
    Sep 8, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    rlbl     Jan 10, 2013 5:43 AM (in response to Out)

    Well I noticed this once in Bo2 (but remembered a video I saw from BO1... when things really got bad with lag).

     

    I was ADSing a window because I saw someone run into a house so I was damn sure he was going up to it..  Before I could see him my gun started to move.  Knowing what lag and lag compensation really is (not saying that everything works fine, just knowing how it works in theory), I started to fire.  I started to get hitmarkers before I could even see the guy; by the time I saw him it took 1 more shot to kill him.

     

    In this case, aim assist worked out. It just looks weird when your gun pulls at what appears to be "nothing". The system knows something is there so your gun moves.

     

    Side Bar:

     

    Not seeing him = Lag

     

    If I had not shot and waited until I saw him this could have happened:

     

    1 - I could have started to fire at the image (which would have been an after image). The system would have confirmed the hit even though I was shooting at a delayed "image" - this is lag compensation

     

    2 - If he saw me, he would have fired on me 1st. By the time I saw him I would have started to fire; maybe or maybe not have gotten hitmarkers; and I would have died by what appears by 1 shot. (this is what we all see and complain about). This is lag

     

    (sorry for the thread hijack, but it illustrates how aim assist can help... and as well how lag can be seen.. and what lag compensation can do to help... and not hinder. The real problem is lag/latency/delay by being improperly matched)

    • dubhicks Apprentice 480 posts since
      Nov 10, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      dubhicks     Jan 10, 2013 5:57 AM (in response to rlbl)

      Silly question, but are you saying that (lag permitting) when I feel my gun tug off before the enemy is on screen, that if I go ahead and hammer on it, I will get a kill? Not doubting you, just never thought to try that. I don't usually put myself into positions where I am normally ADS'ing for very long, but I have noticed when I do, the gun will move shortly followed by the actual person. Wouldn't you know, if I start firing only by what I see on screen (image), I get tons of markers and usually no kill. Interesting...

      • rlbl Master 6,204 posts since
        Sep 8, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated
        rlbl     Jan 10, 2013 6:26 AM (in response to dubhicks)

        Short answer: yes

         

        The problem is our brains will not allow us to shoot at nothing.

         

        What we (just about everyone) does not seem to understand is: Everything that happens in the game, already happened.  What do I mean: Let's say a player is moving from point A to point B:

         

        A---------->B

         

        The problem is: When we see them at point A, they have already moved to a new position: call it X

         

        A----X----->B

         

        The system/host knows they are at point X, but that information has not reached us yet. If the lag was reduced (matchmaking?) the difference (in position and time) between A and X would be minimal...

         

        So what do we do? Well we shoot at A. If the lag is not too bad*, the system says: player you were shooting at A but we know the player is at X and you are lagged by "xxx seconds" so we will award you the kill if we (the system) says yes the player was where you were shooting xxx seconds ago (this is Lag Compensation - a very SIMPLE concept which I cannot figure out why so few people understand it...).

         

        Aim Assist:

         

        Let us say you are ADSING at point A, but the system  knows the player has moved to point X (as above). The gun will keep trying to pull to the right. Our brains say "Hey stupid aim assist, stop pulling me off target!!!" but the reality is: The system is trying to put us on target.

         

        When this happens... FIRE!!!

         

        * if the lag is bad... the system cannot compensate correctly and hit detection goes to hell.

        • TRU11 Expert 1,543 posts since
          Jul 6, 2012
          Currently Being Moderated
          TRU11     Jan 10, 2013 6:50 AM (in response to rlbl)

          well explained.

           

          A+.

           

          still imo aim assist is way to high in this game lol.

          but probaly goes hand in hand with the terrible lagg in this game .

          • rlbl Master 6,204 posts since
            Sep 8, 2011
            Currently Being Moderated
            rlbl     Jan 10, 2013 7:53 AM (in response to TRU11)

            Thank you...

             

            It may not be technically accurate, but it is conceptually.

             

            Aim assist helps, but sometimes maybe a bit too much.

        • BanHaMMer Expert 2,339 posts since
          Jun 8, 2012
          Currently Being Moderated
          BanHaMMer     Jan 10, 2013 8:18 AM (in response to rlbl)

          Wow, what a brilliant analogy "R"

           

          I am impressed, so simple and yet conceptual, as you say.

        • Ungrateful_Dead Novice 428 posts since
          May 30, 2012
          Currently Being Moderated
          Ungrateful_Dead     Jan 10, 2013 12:50 PM (in response to rlbl)

          rlbl, that may be the most concise and complete explanation of lag/lag comp I have seen. 

           

          I used to be able to compensate for connection in mW3 by pre-firing corners as per your example, but it doesn't seem to work for me in BO2.  The difference in connection is too great, and they can run around the corner, throw down a shock charge, betty, eat a sandwich, and then turn around and spray me down with half a SMG clip. 

           

          That's how it looks on the kill cam, anyway.  From my POV, they teleport in front of me and I die so fast I have to watch the kill cam to see how I died.

        • Out Apprentice 872 posts since
          Dec 18, 2011
          Currently Being Moderated
          Out     Jan 10, 2013 1:48 PM (in response to rlbl)

          Going diagram i understand what the system is trying to do .......and you are correct its hard to shoot where you dont see the enemy ..........but lets use this example,,,, i come around a corner you are running away from me.....I ADS down the sights as i bring the weapon up i see the dot or crosshairs dead center of your body mass.....then in a nano second my gun will move just a bit to right.....i fire my rounds anyway....I dont even get a hit marker....but if i force the dot back to the center where i think it should be .i get a hitmarker then then the kill........

           

          I have had a few instance when using AA while sniping at long distances when 1 enemy player crossed close by to the one i was aiming at the sights wanted to move ....and i knew it was because the 2nd player was closer to me......

           

          The thing that has hit me as ODD was while playing like in the example i used above....my gun will always pull to the right....even if you are on the right hand boundry of a map where no one could be....it will try and pull to the right

           

          Now i have only noticed this when the game is Lagging pretty Bad.......you know those games where you have to pinch youself on the nutsack to keep from throwing the controller thru the wall

        • shanerama15 Apprentice 353 posts since
          May 24, 2011
          Currently Being Moderated
          shanerama15     Jan 11, 2013 7:20 AM (in response to rlbl)

          Makes sence... While getting clear from an opponents fire and knowing I made it around a corner I get killed and pulled back a few feet to spot "A".

          • rlbl Master 6,204 posts since
            Sep 8, 2011
            Currently Being Moderated
            rlbl     Jan 11, 2013 9:46 AM (in response to shanerama15)

            I know you know what you mean... but let's get something clear...

             

            You are not "pulled back" - a common misconception of being compensated.

             

            The reality is: the lagged person* does not get the information that you are no longer there. The system compensates for the lag and detects a hit.

             

            Think about things that are very far away from you (like a distant star): the image you see is delayed in time by the distance it is away from you as measured by the speed of light (thus the term light year)

             

            - In the real world you see everything happening around you in real time as light travels so fast; but consider that everything you see has already happened (even if the time delay is so small it is insignificant).

             

            In the data world, the time it takes for information to flow from one place to another is latency, and that is not only physically/mathematically measurable, it is also visually measurable when the data is represented (like in an online game). Lag Compensation tries to make it so everyone around the world sees everything at the same time (which is logically impossible, but required for online gaming).  If the delay is too large (cause by improper matchmaking or other forms of lag which I am not going to talk about), the system cannot compensate, and you get "WTF!?" moments.

             

            * it is possible to create artificial lag, but we will not talk about that because many do not believe it and it only serves to confuse people... more than lag compensation does.

  • RAMBONER Expert 1,080 posts since
    Nov 18, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    RAMBONER     Jan 10, 2013 7:33 AM (in response to Out)

    I turned it off one night since I was sniping and if more then one enemy was in my site it was pulling me in the middle of them.  The next day I was playing and had forgotten I had turned it off.  I  even called my buddy to tell him something had happend and I couldnt stay on target anymore.  I told him I couldnt blame lag but "something just wasnt right".  Closer ranges I was somewhat spraying around and just seemed to be "off".  I thought it was me.  Long shots were the same and I was on target just fine.

     

    Later on that evening I saw a final kill cam where a sniper was pulled between two guys and it dawned on me that I had turned aim assist off.  When I turned it back on the difference when trying to stay on target close and med range was huge.

     

    Aim assist should be turned off and it will make the game much harder for newer people and reward veteran players more.  If AI was off the seperation between bad players, avg players, and good players would be much greater which it should be.

  • ghamorra Master 9,062 posts since
    Sep 17, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    ghamorra     Jan 10, 2013 7:39 AM (in response to Out)

    You can't really play an online game without AA, as you said if the game has no apparent lag issues then it won't bother you much, if the game is lagging just a little (like it seems to most often) AA can certainly help nullify those effects

     

     

    What I think is that AA in this game is way to high, and by way to high I'm talking Bob Marley James Franco high. It's unreal how AA can lock on to someones face from miles away. I'm seeing people sprinting around the map with 11 sensitivity getting headshots with pistols. You can it's "skill" but I've experienced enough help from AA to know that they're just getting some good effects between lag and auto headshot lock-on.

     

     

    Aim Assist should have a range of no more than 10 meters, it's effects should not go beyond 1* of adjustment, and should only be pulled to center mass not the head

     

     

    Black Ops II couldn't have made it any easier to kill people

    • Doc_SoCal Apprentice 1,207 posts since
      Oct 1, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      Doc_SoCal     Jan 10, 2013 12:03 PM (in response to ghamorra)

      ghamorra wrote:

       

      You can't really play an online game without AA, as you said if the game has no apparent lag issues then it won't bother you much, if the game is lagging just a little (like it seems to most often) AA can certainly help nullify those effects

       

       

      What I think is that AA in this game is way to high, and by way to high I'm talking Bob Marley James Franco high. It's unreal how AA can lock on to someones face from miles away. I'm seeing people sprinting around the map with 11 sensitivity getting headshots with pistols. You can it's "skill" but I've experienced enough help from AA to know that they're just getting some good effects between lag and auto headshot lock-on.

       

       

       

      Aim Assist should have a range of no more than 10 meters, it's effects should not go beyond 1* of adjustment, and should only be pulled to center mass not the head

       

      Black Ops II couldn't have made it any easier to kill people

       

       

      Well stated.

       

      It should also not bounce around. If it is on a living target I see no reason why it jumps to another one. I really go nuts when it is a 1v2 in a hallway or something and I lose because my gun has ADD. Turns a lot of easy double kills into a dead me.

  • crossfire-roadster Apprentice 1,138 posts since
    Sep 20, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    crossfire-roadster     Jan 10, 2013 8:27 AM (in response to Out)

    When the game first came out aim assist actually worked for me.  I could feel the pull of the force from some pretty long distances.

      Since the first patch aim assist works in very few matches.  I can definitely tell when its working properly because when i ADS my gun actually locks onto the target.  Normally I can have my reticles almost directly on someone and when I ads I get no help from aim assist and I am off to the right or left by centimeters but when aim assist is working properly it locks right onto the target.  This has been happening since Black Ops 1.  I have no idea if its lag or lag compensation but I do know it is very frustrating.

     

    I did switch aim assist off in Black Ops 1 and could tell no difference because I didn't get much if any help from aim assist in the first place.

  • erikpemberton Novice 362 posts since
    Jun 7, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated
    erikpemberton     Jan 10, 2013 11:55 AM (in response to Out)

    I had to turn it off because it was messing up my shots. I'd be sniping someone from across the map and one of their teammates would run in front of them just as I was about to fire and I wound up firing 10 feet to the side of him instead. The range needs to be limited for it to be useful, IMO.

     

    But what bugs me most about AA is how much it allows talentless QS to get away with being talentless QS. You should not be able to get 6 headshots in 3 seconds with a sniper rifle just by running into a room where a team is protecting an objective and quickscoping.

  • Apprentice 1,408 posts since
    Nov 30, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    SanAndreasPsycho     Jan 10, 2013 1:52 PM (in response to Out)

    So I've played on both PS3 for several hours (prestige 6) and PC with a PS3 controller. I think the only reason the consoles have aim assist is the lag. People really have no idea how much more fun this game is without aim assist on a dedicated server. All it really does it act like a magnet, slowing your cross hairs down when aiming near a target, but without it, the kills feel much more skilled. Anyways, I keep it on for PS3 because if you turn it off then you're playing with a handicap.

  • PsychoHydro Newbie 29 posts since
    Dec 21, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated
    PsychoHydro     Jan 10, 2013 2:28 PM (in response to Out)

    My thoughts an aim assist are it is noobish, but since everybody got it turned on, I always let it stay on because otherwise I would have a big disadvantage.

     

    What's really bad is that it sometimes even shows you the location of an evenmy behind a wall. From time to time, my crosshair even moves while I'm not able to actually see the enemy. That's just dumb and not just noobish but heavily-noobish.

    • Out Apprentice 872 posts since
      Dec 18, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      Out     Jan 11, 2013 4:18 AM (in response to PsychoHydro)

      noobish or not, it is there... I keep it turned off most of the time now, just because it helps me from getting mad as hell when the game lagging badly and i start loosing gunfight after gun fight...at least in my mind i was on target with what i am seeing on screen

       

      I think it is intended for new players, but it is also another line of code with commands that have to pass thru a server, that the server has to track and keep up with (who is using it who is not ect)  that may contribute to lag

       

      I would like to see a game mode where it was stripped down to a real barebones state .....no perks, no AA, no scorestreaks, and only a few weapon attachements if any ......

      keep lag comp in place,then see how the game played for each other, when the only advantage would be your own eye sight and reflexs ......

  • Scorr Apprentice 566 posts since
    Oct 8, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated
    Scorr     Jan 11, 2013 4:23 AM (in response to Out)

    Aim Assist is fine, it has been around forever in the CoD world, but what I don't like is this auto aim we currently have, how your sights essentially stick to an enemy.

     

    If you turn aim assist off in game, you still have a form of aim assist, it just means that your sights track slower when you are aiming at an enemy, meaning it's easier to keep your sights on them, but you still have to do most of the work, which I think is fine, we don't need auto-aim.

     

    It would be interesting to see who would win out of a standard mouse player vs. a controller player using autoaim. Would be close.

  • SnipinDB Novice 406 posts since
    Oct 28, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    SnipinDB     Jan 11, 2013 8:59 AM (in response to Out)

    In the game to please the masses. I helps me using the 360 sticks. On the ps3, yes it helps but without it I would have an advantage above most people do to playing with the ps3 sticks since ps1 back in the late 90's. It's a shooter it should be about aiming ability.

     

    I would limit its effect at least, but it won't happen.

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