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3867 Views 23 Replies Latest reply: Oct 22, 2012 2:15 PM by Jagriff_COD RSS
Ss78_ Apprentice 839 posts since
Sep 21, 2012

League play info

Posted by Ss78_ on Oct 19, 2012 4:39 PM

Does anyone know when they"ll be releasing the information about the league play? I tried searching and only came up with you need to play a few matches to determine your placement and it'll be a win/loss stat that determines it. Maybe I missed a post somewhere or we have to wait until release day but if anyone has any extra info or links it would appreciated.

3867 Views      Tags: league_play
  • Foxhound-Pro GlobalModerator 2,920 posts since
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    Foxhound-Pro     Oct 19, 2012 4:47 PM (in response to Ss78_)

    The finer points have yet to be released, so most of the general stuff you seem to be aware of. Perhaps a peer will have something for you, but I'm pretty sure most information is TBA.

  • iivrruummii Master 3,892 posts since
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    iivrruummii     Oct 19, 2012 4:48 PM (in response to Ss78_)

    I think that it will be kind of like Halo Reach's Arenas, but alot more fair to teamwork.  I think they should have started everyone at like 1500 or so and if you loose to a 1400 you lose 50 and if you win you gain 25.  If you are 1500 and you win against a 1600 you gain 50 and if you loose then you lose 25.  Just my thought on how it should work.  This is only for a 1v1 situation.  When you put more than 2 people then the 1500 could end up at like 1512 or 1467, based on the average of both teams.  If both teams are 1500 then you get 25 for winning and lose 25 for loosing.

     

    NOTE: These are how I think it might work and I haven't played the game.  Just an opinion on how it should work.

    • Ss78_ Apprentice 839 posts since
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      Ss78_     Oct 20, 2012 6:49 AM (in response to iivrruummii)

      Interesting take on it there iivrruummii. So in essence whoever beats the team/player with high rank/standing will move up until they plateau or reach the top rank/standing.

       

      I read somewhere else that our playercard will display our standing for league play and does leave me wondering how it would show our standing if we participate in more than one league. It might just get more people to participate by showing this standing.

       

      This competiveness is something I'm looking forward to.

    • JPE777 Apprentice 1,216 posts since
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      JPE777     Oct 20, 2012 7:01 AM (in response to iivrruummii)

      Your 1500 example appears to be an ELO rating which is fair enough although Im very curious how its all going to be implemented.

       

       

      Further to what has been covered so far in this thread, I believe the following to be correct as well:

       

      * Two league play playlists:

       

      1) 4v4 Team where all 4 players carry the same rating. Change any players and a brand new rating will be applied to that 4 man roster forever forward. No score streaks

       

      2) A 6v6 playlist with scorestreaks on with various gamemodes, option to play solo or with any number of team mates.

       

      * Seven divisions based on ability. It will be this division number/name that will be displayed on your playercard

       

      * A "season" will last about 1 month and at the end, its possible to be promoted or relegated for the next season

       

      * Livestreaming for all players with enough upload bandwith will available but only for league play, not "regular" matches

       

      * Game modes in league play to use a more "competitive" design. For example, domination is two 5 minute rounds (one from each starting spawn) with the highest cumulative score being the winner instead of first to 200. Snd will swap from offense to defense each round and so on.

       

      All of this could very easily be incorrect or be correct at some point but wont be present in the final release but it is some further stuff Ive found out which may be new info for readers.

      • maccabi Master 11,826 posts since
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        maccabi     Oct 20, 2012 7:14 AM (in response to JPE777)

        JPE777 wrote:

         

        Your 1500 example appears to be an ELO rating which is fair enough although Im very curious how its all going to be implemented.

         

         

        Further to what has been covered so far in this thread, I believe the following to be correct as well:

         

        * Two league play playlists:

         

        1) 4v4 Team where all 4 players carry the same rating. Change any players and a brand new rating will be applied to that 4 man roster forever forward. No score streaks

         

        2) A 6v6 playlist with scorestreaks on with various gamemodes, option to play solo or with any number of team mates.

         

        * Seven divisions based on ability. It will be this division number/name that will be displayed on your playercard

         

        * A "season" will last about 1 month and at the end, its possible to be promoted or relegated for the next season

         

        * Game modes in league play to use a more "competitive" design. For example, domination is two 5 minute rounds (one from each starting spawn) with the highest cumulative score being the winner instead of first to 200. Snd will swap from offense to defense each round and so on.

         

        All of this could very easily be incorrect or be correct at some point but wont be present in the final release but it is some further stuff Ive found out which may be new info for readers.

        Most of your information is correct in as much as to whats been "officially" released and or been openly discussed by the devs in interviews. One thing i am pleased you mentioned though was the disclaimer as to what we get in the final release. League "season" duration for example although Vahn has mentioned a time period did add that is likely to change in release .

         

        There is some more information out there about the leagues ect, but it's stuff that people gleemed off the back of the beta leak as I know theres a few screens shots floating around (names of leagues, what the league is for ect ect) so anything like that I would adopt a wait a see approach.

         

        One thing I did want to add though was to ..

         

        JPE777 wrote:

         

        * Livestreaming for all players with enough upload bandwith will available but only for league play, not "regular" matches

         

        While you are correct, there will be additional checks and balances in place for livestreaming, it's not just that a player has enough bandwidth. Until details are officially announced don't "assume" everyone will be able to livestream willy nilly. 

        • JPE777 Apprentice 1,216 posts since
          Sep 28, 2011
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          JPE777     Oct 20, 2012 7:25 AM (in response to maccabi)

          Ah, your right, I forgot about that.

           

          Apart from bandwith, there may very well be other hurdles to overcome in order to stream. A lot of "business" considerations will likely be included too. I know Treyarch said something about having a big enough audience etc which while understandable, right now is a little vague and open to a lot of speculation etc.

           

          Personally, the live streaming thing doesnt really bother me (I doubt Id even have the upload bandwith anyway) but I really want Treyarch to get the League Play feature "correct" overall and on top of that, I want a significant amount of people who play the game to embrace it. Especially as if this happens, then in the future Treyarch will have more reason/room to expand it (for example a 6v6 league play soley for each game mode etc - I dont really like TDM and KC!)

          • -Sovereign- Calculating status... 90 posts since
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            -Sovereign-     Oct 20, 2012 10:39 AM (in response to JPE777)

            i really wish the 6v6 didnt have score streaks either =/

             

            hopefully the top rank isnt easy to achieve. it will suck if it doesnt take a lot of skill to reach that. im hoping its no more than the top 5%

            • iivrruummii Master 3,892 posts since
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              iivrruummii     Oct 20, 2012 11:00 AM (in response to -Sovereign-)

              I am thinking that if it is how I descibed then it could be 2500 and the lowest could be 500.  If this is true then I could see only 5% above 2000.

              • -Sovereign- Newbie 90 posts since
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                -Sovereign-     Oct 20, 2012 11:17 AM (in response to iivrruummii)

                iivrruummii wrote:

                 

                I am thinking that if it is how I descibed then it could be 2500 and the lowest could be 500.  If this is true then I could see only 5% above 2000.

                i thought they said that its a w/l system only?

                 

                you described the traditional trueskill system used in halo 3/reach. its a good system in theory but it is abused very easily by boosters. for those that dont know a booster account is an account intentionally made to have a terrible record by "deranking" so the game thinks that account is really bad. then the booster plays normally with someone he wants to rank boost. when they win the guy who is getting boosted goes up considerably because the boosting account is very bad and doesnt go down much if he losses because of the same reason. it gets worse when there is more than one booster on the same team.

                 

                the unfair part about this is not only does it let people who dont desevre top rank achieve it but it also screws over the people they beat since the losers will go down considerably for losing agaisnt a bad account even if the people playing on that account are actually decent. boosters are quite common in high ranking games of H3 and reach so its not like they are rare or anything either.

                 

                from my experience i would much rather have a w/l system only so it cant be abused.

                • iivrruummii Master 3,892 posts since
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                  iivrruummii     Oct 20, 2012 11:30 AM (in response to -Sovereign-)

                  You can manipulate any ranking system.  W/L wont mean much if you only play against bad players 24/7.  I currently have friends with 100.0W/L and they just pubstomp all day.  If they actually had competition then that would lower.  I mean winning against a good teams is more important that actual W/L.

                  • -Sovereign- Newbie 90 posts since
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                    -Sovereign-     Oct 20, 2012 11:35 AM (in response to iivrruummii)

                    iivrruummii wrote:

                     

                    You can manipulate any ranking system.  W/L wont mean much if you only play against bad players 24/7.  I currently have friends with 100.0W/L and they just pubstomp all day.  If they actually had competition then that would lower.  I mean winning against a good teams is more important that actual W/L.

                    are you forgetting that mw3 had no rank system? that number means literally nothing

                     

                    set up a playlist where you match similar w/l and then the most consistently winning teams match each other. you are then matching good teams if you are a good team. where is the possibilty for manipulation?

                    • iivrruummii Master 3,892 posts since
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                      iivrruummii     Oct 20, 2012 12:00 PM (in response to -Sovereign-)

                      You can manipulate anything.  Network, accounts, xbox, etc.   I guess we just have to wait until the game comes out to know for sure.

                      • -Sovereign- Newbie 90 posts since
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                        -Sovereign-     Oct 20, 2012 12:27 PM (in response to iivrruummii)

                        iivrruummii wrote:

                         

                        You can manipulate anything.  Network, accounts, xbox, etc.   I guess we just have to wait until the game comes out to know for sure.

                        -__-

                         

                        those arent examples of manipulating a ranking system, those are examples of manipulating the game itself.

                         

                        ive given you examples of the abuse that happens with the halo system you brought up. while the "w/l only" system does have its drawbacks; specifically getting the same amount of credit for a win regardless of opponent skill (this drawback isnt that bad because if you are matched ONLY with people of your division, then you are still matching people roughly similar to your own skill level.) the benefit of said system is that players really cant abuse or manipulate ranks via booster and derankers.

                         

                        if you can give an example of way you can abuse the wl only system ill be glad to hear it but i cant think of any way to do so making it the best system to use

                        • iivrruummii Master 3,892 posts since
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                          iivrruummii     Oct 20, 2012 8:25 PM (in response to -Sovereign-)

                          WAIT UNTIL THE GAME COMES OUT.

                          • -Sovereign- Newbie 90 posts since
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                            -Sovereign-     Oct 22, 2012 11:06 AM (in response to iivrruummii)

                            iivrruummii wrote:

                             

                            WAIT UNTIL THE GAME COMES OUT.

                            is speculating off limits now?

                             

                            halo trueskill has been out for a while now anyway, so i can talk about the flaws of that system with 100% accuracy.

            • JPE777 Apprentice 1,216 posts since
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              JPE777     Oct 20, 2012 3:52 PM (in response to -Sovereign-)

              Theres a part of me that wished was the case too although I can tolerate it if everything else regarding league play properly functions.

               

              Also, with regard to competitive esports, CoD suffers more then other game modes due it being drastically different to what a potential viewer would play in a normal game. I get the impression that its Treyarch's halfway house or "bridge" between public matches and competitive matches for people who arent aware of its existance at present.

               

              As for the Elo method (the 1500, 2000 numbers being mentioned etc) and the W/L these can actually be both be used together. The rating moves up for a win and down for the loss but the extent of the rating move depends on other factors (such as strength of opposition.)

               

              I strongly suspect that league play will be based on wins but not the win/loss statistic itself. Somebody who wins 18 and loses 22 matches against the very best players is probably much better then someone who goes 37-3 against very bad players.

               

              Just how they go about it though, Im very intrigued to finsd out more.

  • Jagriff_COD Newbie 29 posts since
    Oct 3, 2012
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    Jagriff_COD     Oct 21, 2012 11:15 AM (in response to Ss78_)

    Search for details about the ladder system that it is place for SC2. Pretty much everything that has been released about League Play has come right out of that system.

    • Ss78_ Apprentice 839 posts since
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      Ss78_     Oct 21, 2012 11:39 AM (in response to Jagriff_COD)

      Thanks for that. So if it's at all similar then no one will be in the highest league at the start as you can only be promoted to this league?

      • Jagriff_COD Newbie 29 posts since
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        Jagriff_COD     Oct 21, 2012 1:13 PM (in response to Ss78_)

        I would assume so, but no detailed information like that has been released yet as far as I know. I am curious as to whether the highest league will be as exclusive as Grandmaster (top 200 active players; not based on percentiles like the other leagues).

        • JPE777 Apprentice 1,216 posts since
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          JPE777     Oct 21, 2012 1:31 PM (in response to Jagriff_COD)

          Again, I cant back this up with conclusive evidence, but did David Vonderhaar originally tweet the 7 divisions symbols and indicated that the top division would be for the top 2%?

           

          Remember, if true, this would be top 2% of those who played the league playlist, not the top 2% of all CoD players.

          • -Sovereign- Newbie 90 posts since
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            -Sovereign-     Oct 22, 2012 11:09 AM (in response to JPE777)

            JPE777 wrote:

             

            Again, I cant back this up with conclusive evidence, but did David Vonderhaar originally tweet the 7 divisions symbols and indicated that the top division would be for the top 2%?

             

            Remember, if true, this would be top 2% of those who played the league playlist, not the top 2% of all CoD players.

            i think there were 6 symbols, not 7. when he tweeted the last symbol he said something like "top 17%" or something so im assuming the top rank is the best 17% or so, which would suck as it would make it way to easy to get

             

            i am going off what ive seen people on youtube say, i could be totally wrong.

          • Jagriff_COD Newbie 29 posts since
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            Jagriff_COD     Oct 22, 2012 2:15 PM (in response to JPE777)

            Well I'd imagine, apart from the competitive players in custom matches, that the top 2% of League Play participants would also be the top 2% of COD players. Although that is kind of a silly notion since the skill cap for COD is generally very low such that the top 20% of players could make an effective case for being one of the top 2%.

  • Ss78_ Apprentice 839 posts since
    Sep 21, 2012
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    Ss78_     Oct 22, 2012 6:57 AM (in response to Ss78_)

    Just read in another thread a tweet about no joining session in progress for league play. This seems like a good idea but will there be a possibility of getting a higher/lower point reward if someone backs out and the team with the less/more players wins?

     

    Even though we'll be stuck in some difficult games because of this scenario(sometimes people just need to leave) it's a good thing from my perspective.

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