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3023 Views 42 Replies Latest reply: Aug 27, 2012 6:05 AM by willfal RSS
scotland-rules Apprentice 877 posts since
Sep 25, 2011

Shotguns, needs to be like MW2

Posted by scotland-rules on Aug 21, 2012 1:33 PM

Yes they do,

 

Black Ops/Trayarch have a horrible history of designing shotguns that suck.

 

I mean they all have such poor range and as primaries I don't they should have such terrible range. I love using a shotgun and love shotgun with range but to be honest. I don't like them in black ops as generally they suck with range,

 

I watch videos on youtube of people firing a spas 12 and then I play on black ops with and thinking (were these people on drugs when they designing the shotguns)

 

I really think they need to be like MW2 at least they were semi realistic in terms of use.

 

I know COD ain't a realstic shooter but to be honest, they pick and choose what they want to be more real and what they want to be in fantasy land.

 

Even looking at the gameplay, I can tell they sort of looks disappointing.

 

Anyway, what do you guys think?

3023 Views     
  • Aecetym Expert 1,769 posts since
    Jun 3, 2012
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    Aecetym     Aug 21, 2012 1:35 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    Shotgun do not need to become AR or SMG's of rang. It a shotgun, meaning (very) close combat weapon.

    If u would add rang to a shotgun it would mean the spread is lowered pretty hard making it a multi-use weapon instat of a tactical/skill weapon.

    • iloveshotguns Apprentice 367 posts since
      May 24, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      iloveshotguns     Aug 21, 2012 3:11 PM (in response to Aecetym)

      Whats the point of having a weapon thats only capable of killing at VERY close range when we already have a knife? Shotguns are not the LEAST bit overpowered, you dont even see 1 person use a shotgun in competitive events.

  • mdub Expert 1,768 posts since
    Sep 19, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    mdub     Aug 21, 2012 1:46 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    The spas 12 in MW2 was perfect.

     

    People will always say shotguns are overpowered.

     

    These same people will then defend why whatever AR they are using is not OP, when it can: 1) destroy a shotgun at close range 2) out hipfire the best smg 3) out snipe a sniper rifle.

     

    This is balance, according to the anti-shotgun segment of the community.

     

    These discussions never end well.

     

    My 2 cents.

  • Grayewsable Expert 942 posts since
    Apr 29, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated
    Grayewsable     Aug 21, 2012 2:47 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    Anyone saying Black Ops shotguns "sucked" wasn't using them properly. They were half-decent relative to the other weapons and from what I've seen from the BO2 R-870, there shouldn't be much to worry about.

  • vileself Master 4,866 posts since
    May 23, 2011
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    vileself     Aug 21, 2012 2:53 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    I like shotguns as secondaries. It makes them more useful.

    • vims1990 Master 7,517 posts since
      Aug 13, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      vims1990     Aug 22, 2012 2:14 AM (in response to vileself)

      vileself wrote:

       

      I like shotguns as secondaries. It makes them more useful.

       

      I would disagree. Shotguns was a terrible idea as default secondaries in MW2. That's really the only reason why they were OP. The Damage and Range were fine, the problem was them being a default secondary.

       

      If shotguns were primaries in MW2, they would have been balanced & still decent for shotgunners.

       

      However in saying that, you will still be able to use them as secondaries but it requires sacrificing a couple of points with the "Pick 10" system as it allows players to have a secondary shotgun using the "Overkill" wildcard.

       

      There's no need to give up a perk for a secondary primary (as it has been in COD4, WAW & MW3) so I feel the Overkill wildcard could be popular if you want to use a secondary shotgun depending on how well Treyarch develop shotguns this time.

  • kawi Newbie 88 posts since
    Jul 26, 2011
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    kawi     Aug 21, 2012 3:16 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    MW2 shotguns were overpowered. And since they were available as secondary, it made them plain ridiculous. BO shotguns were well balanced; great at close range but trash anywhere else. It should be kept that way.

    • mdub Expert 1,768 posts since
      Sep 19, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      mdub     Aug 21, 2012 3:30 PM (in response to kawi)

      kawi wrote:

       

      MW2 shotguns were overpowered. And since they were available as secondary, it made them plain ridiculous. BO shotguns were well balanced; great at close range but trash anywhere else. It should be kept that way.

      The 1887s (especially akimbo = IW incompetence) were overpowered before the patch (actually multiple patches = IW incompetence). The others were perfect.

       

      Nobody should have complained if the spas 12 (as an example) would have been a primary.

      • nicka_denton Novice 208 posts since
        Aug 16, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated
        nicka_denton     Aug 22, 2012 7:20 PM (in response to mdub)

        mdub wrote:

         

        kawi wrote:

         

        MW2 shotguns were overpowered. And since they were available as secondary, it made them plain ridiculous. BO shotguns were well balanced; great at close range but trash anywhere else. It should be kept that way.

        The 1887s (especially akimbo = IW incompetence) were overpowered before the patch (actually multiple patches = IW incompetence). The others were perfect.

         

        Nobody should have complained if the spas 12 (as an example) would have been a primary.

        The spas 12 WAS overpowered in MW2 but is still one of the funnest guns in COD for me to date - as for the 1887's. I Loved those things before the patches, way too OP and glad they did patch em but it was kinda fun having dual sniper rifles that you could no-scope across the map and wipe people out for a while when the game first came out... back on topic tho - The olympia was a great shotgun in Black ops, not too much range but powerfull as a shotgun should be..

  • Riddell26 Calculating status... 2 posts since
    Jul 6, 2012
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    Riddell26     Aug 21, 2012 3:49 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    Videogames in general just dont fully grasp the concept of balistics. Every shooter has made the same constant mistakes, either with shotguns, lmg's, or any other weapon class. A good example is how in every game an smg does more damage than an assault rifle, or an lmg. Which is absurd when you think about it, true smg's can put more down range, before an assault rifle in any span of time. That is because it has smaller rounds, which means less damage, meaning it takes more to put some one down. While assault rifles and lmg's have bigger rounds, which causes more damage because of how it deforms once it enters the body. Basically im saying smg's shouldn't kill faster than an lmg or assault rifle, or a shotgun for that matter.

  • T-boss Expert 1,647 posts since
    May 30, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated
    T-boss     Aug 21, 2012 8:23 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    MW2 shotguns, possiblty slitly stronger. and make them primaries.that should work fine if there are good shotgun maps. already see one i plan to use shotguns on if they are good.

    • scotland-rules Apprentice 877 posts since
      Sep 25, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      scotland-rules     Aug 21, 2012 11:11 PM (in response to T-boss)

      I was watching some youtube comentary of someone who play BO2 and they commented on how the shotgun range was poor from the ones he used. So that is why I made this thread.

  • Film_Not_Rated Apprentice 1,264 posts since
    Mar 8, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated
    Film_Not_Rated     Aug 21, 2012 11:32 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    Personally wouldn't like the shotguns to follow MW2's, as it was fun to snipe people with the Spas, it was also annoying.

     

    MW3's were indeed trash, and Blops were to a point but pretty fun to use to be honest, and did good if you could actually use them properly.

     

    Maybe a mix of both games (MW2 range, Maybe Blops1 damage.) But who knows.

     

    "The future is Black."

     

    Lol.

  • Grayewsable Expert 942 posts since
    Apr 29, 2012
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    Grayewsable     Aug 22, 2012 8:43 AM (in response to scotland-rules)

    Black Ops shotgun stat's with built-in Stopping Power (more pellets) and infinite range but massive drop-off. Make them more reliable at close-range, viable at middle ranges and yet still lose 9 out of 10 times to anyone with an automatic weapon at distance.

     

    I thought the only shotgun that was really good in Black Ops was the SPAS-12, and even then, it could easily lose to the Skorpion at medium-range. They were still bloody fun to use though.

    • T-boss Expert 1,647 posts since
      May 30, 2012
      Currently Being Moderated
      T-boss     Aug 22, 2012 11:53 AM (in response to Grayewsable)

      i used the olympa because its the only one with stoping power and range to kill quickly. it was also the closest to my preffered shotgun the akimbo ranger, very good at killing and is all or nothing. spas was a slitily less likly kill but pump sometimes allowed a second shot depending on who you were shooting.

  • Monster_Truck Newbie 12 posts since
    Jul 9, 2012
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    Monster_Truck     Aug 22, 2012 10:38 AM (in response to scotland-rules)

    Snipers have a CQC ability, shotguns don't have any long range ability. In real life, shotguns have a much greater range.

     

    Give shotguns a damage and range boost, as someone said, the MW2 shotguns were perfect.

  • ChestSplittah Master 8,968 posts since
    Jun 11, 2012
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    ChestSplittah     Aug 22, 2012 11:36 AM (in response to scotland-rules)

    Move shotguns back to Secondaries as they should be.

    • T-boss Expert 1,647 posts since
      May 30, 2012
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      T-boss     Aug 22, 2012 11:51 AM (in response to ChestSplittah)

      there fine as primaries if tehy have MW2 stats, if they have pre buff MW3 stats those shotguns are the only good ones for secondaries.

      • scotland-rules Apprentice 877 posts since
        Sep 25, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated
        scotland-rules     Aug 22, 2012 3:48 PM (in response to T-boss)

        Shotguns should be secondaries and be like the previous two cods, MW2 shotguns were perfect and reflected how shotguns really should be.

         

        A power house a close to slight medium range.

        • T-boss Expert 1,647 posts since
          May 30, 2012
          Currently Being Moderated
          T-boss     Aug 22, 2012 5:44 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

          i like them more as primaries, if they are secondaries then they need to be nerfed.

           

          but there still needs to be maps good for shotguns, hopefully like MW3 post buff or MW2 with slight buff.

    • Film_Not_Rated Apprentice 1,264 posts since
      Mar 8, 2012
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      Film_Not_Rated     Aug 22, 2012 5:51 PM (in response to ChestSplittah)

      LOL NO.

       

      They are primaries... If they give them a damage/range boost then they should not be a secondary, keep that to pistols,MP's and launchers.

  • rrclimber Newbie 35 posts since
    Dec 15, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    rrclimber     Aug 22, 2012 4:20 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    I would love to see the shotguns removed entirely. MW3 has turned them into the new noob tube. They are ridiculously overpowered because the maps are so damn small. Those things breath fire in ridiculuos radius. I don't want to see the game turn into Gears of War. The way it stands now we are just a barrel roll away...

    • vims1990 Master 7,517 posts since
      Aug 13, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      vims1990     Aug 22, 2012 4:38 PM (in response to rrclimber)

      rrclimber wrote:

       

      I would love to see the shotguns removed entirely. MW3 has turned them into the new noob tube. They are ridiculously overpowered because the maps are so damn small. Those things breath fire in ridiculuos radius. I don't want to see the game turn into Gears of War. The way it stands now we are just a barrel roll away...

       

      You should try using the pump action shotguns before accusing them of being OP.

       

      They're more difficult to use compared to the MP7 or ACR.

    • mdub Expert 1,768 posts since
      Sep 19, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      mdub     Aug 22, 2012 4:45 PM (in response to rrclimber)

      rrclimber wrote:

       

      I would love to see the shotguns removed entirely. MW3 has turned them into the new noob tube. They are ridiculously overpowered because the maps are so damn small. Those things breath fire in ridiculuos radius. I don't want to see the game turn into Gears of War. The way it stands now we are just a barrel roll away...

      I totally know what you mean! It sucks when Im completely destroying shotgunners with my ACR, at ALL ranges, and then that noob with a spas gets a cheap kill from point blank range.......

       

       

       

       

      You can not be serious about MW3 shotguns.

    • T-boss Expert 1,647 posts since
      May 30, 2012
      Currently Being Moderated
      T-boss     Aug 22, 2012 5:46 PM (in response to rrclimber)

      are you one of the people who complain when someone uses a AA12 in MW3 when (after using all the shotguns) AA12 is hands down the weakest?

    • nicka_denton Novice 208 posts since
      Aug 16, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      nicka_denton     Aug 22, 2012 7:31 PM (in response to rrclimber)

      rrclimber wrote:

       

      I would love to see the shotguns removed entirely. MW3 has turned them into the new noob tube. They are ridiculously overpowered because the maps are so damn small. Those things breath fire in ridiculuos radius. I don't want to see the game turn into Gears of War. The way it stands now we are just a barrel roll away...

      The only thing that has turned them OP is the gun proficiancies like range and damage, this along with certain shotgun's fire rates etc can make them unstopable in core and hardcore game modes. I enjoyed the gun proficiancies in MW3 but in a way im glad that they won't return as they changed the guns way too much and made them harder to balance

  • neoreaper Apprentice 477 posts since
    Jul 14, 2011
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    neoreaper     Aug 22, 2012 6:17 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    Are you mentally retarded?

    • T-boss Expert 1,647 posts since
      May 30, 2012
      Currently Being Moderated
      T-boss     Aug 22, 2012 6:20 PM (in response to neoreaper)

      my bets your dummer than the support shotguns guy.

      • neoreaper Apprentice 477 posts since
        Jul 14, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated
        neoreaper     Aug 22, 2012 6:31 PM (in response to T-boss)

        T-boss wrote:

         

        my bets your dummer than the support shotguns guy.

        really thats your reply?

        • T-boss Expert 1,647 posts since
          May 30, 2012
          Currently Being Moderated
          T-boss     Aug 22, 2012 6:52 PM (in response to neoreaper)

          post to buff shotguns from BO stats, BO shotguns are next to never used and considered useless: underpowered.

           

          your post tells me you think shotguns should be useless(balance fail), and having them balanced would be great, when the only OP shotguns in cod are MW2 because they were SECONDARIES, not because they were usefull.

           

          also almost every post like that is, this is to weak: guy who doenst want ot be killed complains becasue he can now get killed by something else.

           

          and like i said, i bet your the dum one.

  • TheXraptor Novice 143 posts since
    Jul 24, 2012
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    TheXraptor     Aug 22, 2012 9:44 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    I full heartedly agree. MW2 shotguns were not overpowered because of their usefulness, they were overpowered because you could combine them with an ACR or Intervention.

     

    The closest thing Treyarch has ever gotten to a functional shotgun was the Silenced SPAS in Black Ops, and even then, that thing only worked when it wanted to (as in, sometimes it was a 1-2 hit kill, sometimes it was a 4-5 hit kill).

     

    The M1216 could be a promising weapon when combined with Long Barrel, and the R-870 does not look bad either, however, if they are going to make shotguns primary weapons, they should be able to compete with Assault Rifles.

  • robbierocket Master 3,521 posts since
    May 31, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    robbierocket     Aug 24, 2012 4:26 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    I read the thread title and just laughed. I haven't read any posts, I can't think of a worse possibility that shotguns being like in MW2 so saying that they need to be like that is hilarious to me.

     

    Wait, no there is a worse scenario - make them able to auto-kill people at 100 metres range, then they may balance quickscoping....

    • mdub Expert 1,768 posts since
      Sep 19, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      mdub     Aug 26, 2012 11:40 PM (in response to robbierocket)

      robbierocket wrote:

       

      I read the thread title and just laughed. I haven't read any posts, I can't think of a worse possibility that shotguns being like in MW2 so saying that they need to be like that is hilarious to me.

       

      Wait, no there is a worse scenario - make them able to auto-kill people at 100 metres range, then they may balance quickscoping....

      I  challenge you to a FFA match, in MW2. You can take the spas 12 (since its so OP) and I'll take the UMP45 with rapid fire. After I mop the floor with you, then we can start talking weapon balance.

      • robbierocket Master 3,521 posts since
        May 31, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated
        robbierocket     Aug 27, 2012 2:59 AM (in response to mdub)

        Hahahaha. I commend your primevil sence of duelling.

         

        I never said SG's were OP in MW2 OR that the UMP was not, I could say some things there but that's not the point. I laughed at someone saying SG's should be like they are in MW2, which I think was done poorly, hastily and without character. Nevermind akimbo AA-12's.

        • vims1990 Master 7,517 posts since
          Aug 13, 2011
          Currently Being Moderated
          vims1990     Aug 27, 2012 3:46 AM (in response to robbierocket)

          robbierocket wrote:

           

          Hahahaha. I commend your primevil sence of duelling.

           

          I never said SG's were OP in MW2 OR that the UMP was not, I could say some things there but that's not the point. I laughed at someone saying SG's should be like they are in MW2, which I think was done poorly, hastily and without character. Nevermind akimbo AA-12's.

           

          I don't see a problem if MW3 shotguns dealt the same power as MW2 shotguns as primary weapons.

           

          Switching them to primaries was the right move however nerfing it's base damage & forcing a player to rank the shotgun up 28 times to get damage was harsh enough to a weapon class that is barely used as it is. (unless it a default secondary option of course)

           

          The akimbo machine pistols in MW3 are more worthy as a primary weapon than the pump action shotguns in it's current state.

  • strangelilhippie Newbie 54 posts since
    Aug 24, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated
    strangelilhippie     Aug 24, 2012 9:15 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    what if they made certain shotguns secondary and some primary? Which would mean redesigning spread and range. A Olympia style hunting shotgun would have relatively low sprfead and far better range than what it is normally given so you would make that a primary. A good balance with that style would be give it the abilty to fire both barrels for a one shot kill, but extreme recoil (as a shotgun is want to do) meaning if you dont land the shot you will be running on luck if you dont reload in time. Maybe even a single barrel style with a strategy not unlike a semi-auto rifel(M14) but a point of difference between it and semi-auto rifles would be only one bullet but a fast reload time to make up for it For a secondary you could have a sawed off shotgun with a range and spread more akin to the "classic" shooter design. Other types like a semi-auto shotgun would have have shooting styles that we are all familiar with but maybe make them a weaker gauge like a 20 to counter thew shitstorm of rounds they unleash.  That way both sides of the coin will be a appeased.

  • scotland-rules Apprentice 877 posts since
    Sep 25, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    scotland-rules     Aug 26, 2012 11:13 PM (in response to scotland-rules)

    To all people who said shotguns were OP as secondaries. Well to be honest I could of just used the spas 12 as a primary and then the 3 round burst machine pistol which killed well at all ranges.

     

    However as secondaries shotguns are really good and would be used more.

    • willfal Apprentice 441 posts since
      Sep 21, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      willfal     Aug 27, 2012 6:05 AM (in response to scotland-rules)

      Ah the Raffica.. a pocket Famas..

       

      I didnt have a problem with shotties in MW2.. even akimbo'd.. personally i liked the range they had, it gave the user the ability to run around like a nut and have fun... the way mw3 and blops shotties work you have to pick your routes and keep to the buildings (campy) in order to actually get a kill... even then a 1HK at point blank is a rare thing indeed.

       

      MW2 shotties.. - good.

      All COD's since - Shite.

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