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8567 Views 35 Replies Latest reply: Dec 23, 2011 12:33 PM by dexter1992 RSS
dexter1992 Apprentice
dexter1992
1,113 posts since
Sep 21, 2011
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Sep 25, 2011 7:41 PM

I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

Here is the video I made - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNmUi7AZLoE&feature=channel_video_title

 

I hope this video will give you guys a better understanding on which system was the best. I would like you to share your input as much as possible. MW3 is still in production so we must do all that we can to give the developers IW/SH input on what worked and what didn't. As you know matchmaking in Call of Duty is a make or break feature. For instance the ping/lanteny matching system in MW2 was easily the best and gave the most smooth gameplay. Black Ops did not have this system so it made hit dtection horrible and also made what lag you had worse. In the video I show MW2, BO, and COD4 matchmaking, I also explain the systems and why MW2's was the best. This is actually the first video I ever made so it's not the best but I beleive I got the point across. I made it specifically for MW3 feedback, so I hope most of you will agree and make sure to give your word in the comments. Every bit of feedback helps.

 

So far things confirmed in MW3's matchmaking system:

 

1 - Latency system is back - At 24:37 in this video it shows the Finding Games: <50ms ping(Which was in MW2) Here is the link - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mw1uu_uUw7I&feature=channel_video_title

 

2 - The bandwidth requirment has been reduced lower than previous titles in MW3 - Confirmed in a 50 Miniute Audio interview with Modern Warfare 3 Executive Producer Mark Rubin - Here is the link - http://www.gamertagradio.com/new/2011/09/episode-307-interview-with-executive-pr oducer-mark-rubin-producer-jason-ades-about-modern-warfare-3-elite/

 

3 -There will be a Locale matchmaking option in MW3 as well - Confirmed in a Tweet on twitter - This is what was tweeted by fourzerotwo: "Lots of work went into optimizing local search engines, especially for foreign players."

 

4 - P2P matchmaking on consoles is also confirmed and tweeted by fourzerotwo on Twitter.

 

Now the all time question is if the Locale setting is seperate, or is it combined with the latency system. If combined that will be the best option and will provide the best quality on P2P. If the Locale setting is like Black Ops with no latency matching than it will be faster but give worse hit detection.

 

I want to see the ping/latency system as it was exactly in MW2, and have an option for a Local/Latency matching combined system. I feel that is the best way for IW/SH to go when trying to make MW3 run well.

 

So I hope you guys like my video and agree with me, and find this information helpful. Thanks!

  • esmorgue Master
    esmorgue
    6,606 posts since
    Jul 9, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 25, 2011 8:36 PM (in response to dexter1992)
    I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

    I agree that we need the system from MW2 also. Even when I ran wireless, even though the router wasn't very far from the PS3. To me this would be the optimal matchmaking system to re-introduce back into CoD. It was apparent that Black Ops didnt work. Although their system was probably a beta to be worked on for introduction as an enhancement system to tighten up the search area on this CoD to go along with the MW2 system In short, PLEASE bring back the MW2 system.

  • iif0xh0undii GlobalModerator
    iif0xh0undii
    10,709 posts since
    May 23, 2011
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    Sep 25, 2011 9:51 PM (in response to dexter1992)
    I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

    Matchmaking doesn't work the way you claim in Modern Warfare 2. Not everyone in that lobby is going to be at a 150MS ping. You've simply connected to a host that when pinged was less than 150MS for you. Someone could be local to that person and have a less than 50MS ping and be in there too.

     

    To be honest, I wouldn't try playing online with your connection. You're playing over 3G? As in, you're playing on a 3G hotspot? Your upload is less than 1Mbps and your DL is less than 2Mbps? That's a terrible connection to play on and to expect anything worthwhile from an online FPS.

     

    To my knowledge, Black Ops uses the same type of matchmaking. That's really the only way for it to work. The main difference is that Modern Warfare 2 will show you what pings they are querying.

    • esmorgue Master
      esmorgue
      6,606 posts since
      Jul 9, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      Sep 25, 2011 10:03 PM (in response to iif0xh0undii)
      I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

      My reason for thinking it is different is because I never had such lobbies as that were in Black Ops constantly filled with foreign players, as in MW2.  I always seemed to play with the sam people the whole 1st yr of the game being out. With a few different ones here and there.

    • dexter1992 Apprentice
      dexter1992
      1,113 posts since
      Sep 21, 2011
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      Sep 25, 2011 10:48 PM (in response to iif0xh0undii)
      Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

      iif0xh0undii wrote:

       

      Matchmaking doesn't work the way you claim in Modern Warfare 2. Not everyone in that lobby is going to be at a 150MS ping. You've simply connected to a host that when pinged was less than 150MS for you. Someone could be local to that person and have a less than 50MS ping and be in there too.

       

      To be honest, I wouldn't try playing online with your connection. You're playing over 3G? As in, you're playing on a 3G hotspot? Your upload is less than 1Mbps and your DL is less than 2Mbps? That's a terrible connection to play on and to expect anything worthwhile from an online FPS.

       

      To my knowledge, Black Ops uses the same type of matchmaking. That's really the only way for it to work. The main difference is that Modern Warfare 2 will show you what pings they are querying.

      lol...ok foxy, yes the host could have a local friend in the lobby with less than 150ms, I was saying that since everyone who goes to find games is matched with their latency then everyone in my lobby would be pinging the host at 150ms as well. So ya there can be some variation but for the most part everyone would be pinging the host at 150ms.

       

      Gaming on 3G is not the best, but it works just fine in MW2. I actually had to cut some good gameplay because I kept messing up the video. I was top player most of the time. So I think it's safe to say my connection is fine for MW2. For Black Ops no.

       

      Black Ops is not the same system, I can't believe you would think that. Between all of the people who claim MW2's system was better. Plus in the video it showed me getting into a match with in seconds not a minute or two like MW2.

       

       

      And it's not just low latency that matters, the game should have an even playing field. Matching people's pings in groups like 150ms makes the hit detection, timing or whatever between players even.

       

      And it's obvious that you don't understand how little bandwidth is needed to play cod. Every run a program like DU meter through ICS running it to the PS3. The bandwidth needed is far less than a download of 1mbps, and upload was even less needed. Uping a connection to 20mbps like people said they were doing on the bo forums didn't help. It's all latency speed that really matters, obviously Treyarch didn't get the memo.

      • iif0xh0undii GlobalModerator
        iif0xh0undii
        10,709 posts since
        May 23, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated
        Sep 25, 2011 11:01 PM (in response to dexter1992)
        I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

        You're interpreting the range at which the game searches for a host as a category that gamers are placed into. That isn't the case. Hypothetically, if you and I search for the same gametype, in the same city, and our host is twenty miles out your ping could be dramatically different than mine simply because of how our connection is set up.

         

        I'm quite certain that Modern Warfare 2 or Black Ops for that matter does not state that "Player 'Z' is designated for all players who MUST have a ping that is greater than or equal to 100ms but less than or equal to 150ms. That would be incredibly inefficient. The fact that this doesn't work is evident in the rare chance that you're thrown into a foreign lobby. As an example, you can jump into an AUS lobby where everyone and there friend has less than a 50ms connection to eachother but you're suffering with a "red bar" connection of over 200ms.

         

        Yes, Black Ops uses the same system. Matchmaking systems may seem different but they perform the same basic search for Modern Warfare onwward. You search to connect to a host with minimal ping and then the game finds the best host possible in that range. The only real disparities are the fact that some are graphically noted, some are not, and some handle Locale Searching much differently. Remember when many of the AUS/NZ gamers wanted a visible Locale Search for MW2? It never came because Fourzerotwo stated that the MP search did this automatically. However gamers were so hooked on their misconception that the were up in arms over it. This is the same situation.

         

        Latency is dynamic and I'd hate for any system to assign me a latency bracket. If I wanted to choose my experience based on ping I'd get the PC version and search for local DS in my state.

        • dexter1992 Apprentice
          dexter1992
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          Sep 21, 2011
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          Sep 26, 2011 5:36 AM (in response to iif0xh0undii)
          Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

          The local option in black ops matches you with hosts in your region. Which would in a sense make you get lower ping times to the host, that would work well with any good configured cable connection. For me the MW2 system helped me more. I have never found any game under 100ms. Where at my friends same game, same platform and he has cable finds games at 50-60ms everytime. It goes by your connection for sure.

           

          I am sure BO isn't like MW2, if I am correct BO shows your bandwidth speed in the connectivity menu, I wonder if that is the number they look at when picking hosts. If I remember the number it showed was many times worse than or completely wrong then what the user actually had.

           

          In short MW2's system was better, I just hope the developers look back at what was done right.

           

          Also your thing about fourzerotwo and MW2 with the viable search thing, if you are pinging a host at 50-150ms, they would be local to you.

           

          But in MW2 the process of finding games was longer, I think Treyarch figured the region system would give the same performance, while keeping search times fast. The difference is the variation in pings among players making hit detection among the game un-synched.

  • maccabi Master
    maccabi
    11,900 posts since
    May 31, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 26, 2011 6:21 AM (in response to dexter1992)
    Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

    Dexter with the greatest of respect, an issue you have bought over from the blackops forum is making posts in such a way as to present them as facts, When  are not.

     

    You really need to add a disclaimer to the start of posts such as these explaining that what you are posting is in fact your own assumptions and not necessarily factually correct.

     

    Whilst my own expereince and knowledge comes from the xbox side of things , the gist of matchmaking on both the ps3 and xbox are basically the same.

     

    You seem to have forgotten or maybe entirely missed the absolute debacle that was mw2's matchmaking when the game first shipped, the hundreds of posts screaming for changes especially from the southern hemisphere players on all platforms, and the numerous hotfixes/title updates it took iw to tinker with their flawed IWNET system until they basically got it working better with both xbl and psns matchmaking system. Also lets not forget they added a pointless placebo GUI to the matchmaking.

    basically the old IW tried to be smart arses and it backfired completely when they tried unsucessfully to change a matchmaking system that relied and still does on the actual platform doing the matchmaking and use the same sort of system they made for the pc with iwnet.

     

    There is on both systems a finite amount of parameters that can be used for matchmaking, regardless of what fancy gui a developer adds ultimately any system will just send requests to the platforms matchmaking servers be it the psn or xbl ones.

     

    The reason there is a finite set of parameters is due to what infomation each platform holds and is able to utilise in matchmaking, There are basically four main sets of parameters that can be used and mixed and matched there after each system has very strict rules for devs as to what they can and cant do request when it comes to accessing infomation for matchmaking.

     

    The first is geographical- This is set by what country/geographical region you added in your registration infomation and the region lock/code of your console. Neither console is able to match via a players ip address.

     

    The second is ping -to the games backend server - in the case of CoD its the demonware servers that sit behind the xpls gateway on xbox and whatever psn archiac system is called nowadays since the hack.

     

    The third is ping to an already open lobby again this is ping based once it has past through the backend of the platforms.

     

    The fourth is really just a matchmaking string made up of all or some of the above.

     

    On top of these, the platforms own matchmaking has some more options that developers can utilise, for example on xbl we have the truskill system where gamers can be matched by gamerscore or or variation there of.

    Then you have the specific game requirements for example matching players only by game type so you arent sitting in a tdm lobby and suddenly find yourself surrounded by players who wanted to play ffa for example.

     

    Regardless of platform showing the ping is actually detrimental to console matchmaking as players percieve ping numbers differently than they should pings are alot higher on consoles than they are on pcs and whereas a 100ms odd ping would send a pc gamer into fits that actually a pretty normal and low ping for a console player. This is why devs prefer to show conecction in a broaded sense by bars, its also important to remember that even when a match is made by ping its a snapshot of the time the matchmaking request was made and may not give an accurate assessment of how a players ping would be in game.

     

    Matchmaking from a players point of view basically boils down to your own perception, personaly I feel mw2s system was flawed , slow and was an exercise in badly reinventing the wheel, blackops whilst in my opion worked alot better and more importantly faster, it also had issues with the host side of things . will mw3's system be any good atm there is no point really speculating as we wont know until it ships and we see it used under real world conditions and stresses

    • dexter1992 Apprentice
      dexter1992
      1,113 posts since
      Sep 21, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated
      Sep 26, 2011 8:00 AM (in response to maccabi)
      Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

      Did you really just use Whilst?

       

      I am not a developer so yes I can't say it's fact, but I know what I said is still true. Hit detection is better on IW titles where as Treyarch's are worse.

       

      You can go all about re-saying information from devs in your own way to make people perceive you know a lot, when in fact it's just a matter of changing the words and taking the work from another person. I go by first-hand experience, and the latency matchmaking to hosts based on an individual user's connection is better than, Regional in the fact that with regional you connect to hosts that can be quite father away, and the timing between players is offset by matching through region, where instead you can be matched by connections and have fair latency timing from player to player making disadvantages/advantages between players less.

       

      Maybe you should go back to the black ops forums and go get more information from Vahn and come back. The person who has already quietly admitted there is a problem with matchmaking on black ops.

      • maccabi Master
        maccabi
        11,900 posts since
        May 31, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated
        Sep 26, 2011 8:38 AM (in response to dexter1992)
        Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

        New forum same old dexter then I see,

         

        You know instead of getting all defense and argumentative and if im honest needlessly hostile and insulting how about being the better person and say you know what hands up i was wrong.

         

        simple fact is you are presenting stuff as fact when it isn't that isnt fair to people reading your posts and in the long run causes more problems and a reason why you should add a disclaimer to your posts on topics such as these..

         

        You still seem to be hung up on the fact I stated stuff a few months back which Vahn had also said, and lets be clear this was after people had also tried unsuccessfully to correct your infactual statements is by the by. But seriously there's only so many ways you can describe how game traffic is sent and the fact Vahn stated the same just shows I was right as usual. As for the rest I cant be bothered to get into a he said she said pointless debate with you from experiences past i know you have an incredibly intractable opinion. Even when you end up discussing an issue with someone with alot more experience and knowledge and credentials in game dev than you have.

         

        As for the  "should go back to the other forums" you are aware unlike the old forums posts show up on the main page now? and that is a good thing as it encourages better cross platform community than the old forums.

         

        You know mate protip for free, forums arent really the place to try to build an ego and reputation if you cant handle constructive criticism , protip you may find people respect you more when you can be the better man and say hey you know what i was wrong hands up thanks i learnt something here.

         

        and yes i did use the word whilst, i like it and your point in mentioning that was what exactly?

        • dexter1992 Apprentice
          dexter1992
          1,113 posts since
          Sep 21, 2011
          Currently Being Moderated
          Sep 26, 2011 8:52 AM (in response to maccabi)
          Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

          I am a generally an outgoing person, but it's people who start crap like you did it was makes me get a bit defensive. So I was wrong with the region thing, oh well.

           

          I was just trying to make a thread to promote the old system and try and explain how it worked compared to BO.

           

          Then you come along  acting like you know the complete backbone of the system when you are not a developer, and just take information from Vahn.

           

          If you can explain and prove the BO's system is the way it is, and works the same as MW2's then I will claim you to be right. But right now all I hear is I am wrong with not much evidence to prove it.

           

           

          Just read the forums, look at how many people are on my side.

           

          Explain the difference between MW2's system and Black Ops's system.

          • maccabi Master
            maccabi
            11,900 posts since
            May 31, 2011
            Currently Being Moderated
            Sep 26, 2011 11:20 AM (in response to dexter1992)
            Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

            Right first off forums are not popularity contests, if you make a post to garner popularity or to virtually pump you epeen larger you seriously need to rethink what type of posts you wish to be remembered for.

             

            This may sound harsh but I couldn't give a flying woohoozy how many people are on your "side" as I said posting on a forum should never be about popularity when it comes to certian subjects  If anything going back to our previous "debate" on the ps3 blops forum yourself and that other guy whose name I cant remember (says alot imo) stuck to your guns about cod being p2p and your happy band of followers all stuck up for you. This is exactly my point. You decided to put yourself out there as the ps3 forums veritable wikipedia of all things cod by that you have a duty to make sure any infomation you give is either 100% correct or is given with the clear understanding it is an opinion or assumption. I really cant see nor understand why you have such problem with a disclaimer in these types of posts?

             

            I said it before and I'll say it again i am happy to give props towards you for the stuff you have done to help ps3 users , dont have a problem with it at all you just need to lose some of the defensiveness and misplaced arrogance.

             

            I really dont understand why you cling to this misconception  that I dont know what i'm talking about and continually refer to one instance where I and others told you something which vahn had also said months previously . This is your evidencial "proof"??? well done that man bravo bravo those months watching Ally Mcbeal reruns sure paid off for you,.

             

            Again just so we are completely clear here and for others reading this post, WHILST this post has some merit it is ultimately an opinion of yours and should be treated and presented as such.

            Whether you then accept what other people tell you when they point out where your assumptions are wrong is entirely different matter. But to argue a point by trying to discredit someone elses input based on a previously flawed assumption will just end up badly for you.

             

            If you want to me to  validate what I have said previously on this matter, I am sorry to dissapoint you not going to happen, I dont suffer from an egotistical need to garner popularity, prefering a more altruistic approach to offering advice . as well as prefering to keep a level of anonynity which i would lose if i explained why i know what i do. To be brutally honest here in doing so would serve no purpose, and in doing so would ultimately score neither of us brownie points that lets be honest neither one of us needs nor in your case should need .

             

            Keep calm and carry on (albeit WHILST remembering to add relevant disclaimers as to not further confuddle the the cult of dexter)

            • dexter1992 Apprentice
              dexter1992
              1,113 posts since
              Sep 21, 2011
              Currently Being Moderated
              Sep 26, 2011 5:06 PM (in response to maccabi)
              Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

              Wth..man you have issues beyond anything I can really understand. You don't back up what you are saying instead just take parts of what I say and re-work the words in you favor. Bringing up Ally Mcbeal, and me being a cult is a joke and you really need to stop getting butt hurt over these posts of mine. You know how many other even worthless post are out there yet you choose to attack mine which actually have reasoning, not something said by Vahn who could be lying to shut people up, not saying he did, but you know how that crap works. What else was I supposed to expect for cod being p2p when you have people like robert bowling tweeting p2p for consoles. If no one defended there point even in error were would the world be. And what are you talking about popularity, I barely post anything. I just want MW3 to run good and I believe the MW2 system is the way to go. While you continue to be even more defensive than me you refused to back up you side, because you say you don't need to, and we all know what kind of people those are.

               

              I will make an example your little brain can maybe possibly...ehhhh..well I will try..so you can understand.

               

              Player in BO hits find game:

               

              Host - in Florida - Players match through region.

               

              MN - Player 1 pings host at 150ms(Me)

              CA - Player 2 pings host at 100ms

              IL - Player 3 pings hosts at 90ms

              TN - Player 4 pings host at 50ms

              SD - Player 5 pings host at 120ms

              ND - Player 6 pings host at 70ms

               

              Now put all of them in a game, you are saying there is no variation and that there will be no timing difference between players. Yes there is and it's evident in the game, my video, and other players feedback.

               

              Player in MW2 hits find game:

               

              Host - in Texas - Players matched through their connection(ping)

               

              IL - Player 1 pings host  at 150ms(me)

              MO - Player 2 pings host  at 150ms

              MN - Player 3 pings host  at 150ms

              TN - Player 4 pings host  at 150ms

              FL - Player 5 pings host  at 150ms

              ND - Player 6 pings host  at 150ms

               

              They all go through the same process in MW2 so in order to get into the 150ms lobby they pinged at that speed so when they shoot me, it takes 150ms to register, when I shoot him it takes 150ms to register. It's synced between players and fair, and no advantage/disadvantage between players.

               

              Here is a nother example:

               

              My friend and I want to play together, we live across the street from each other, we get in the same lobby. Is our connection equal?...****No, I am running Sprint 3G, My friend is running cable. My connection can't just ping to his house across the street. I have to ping my HA(Home Agent) which is in Chicago, IL, I live in MN, so my ping must hop to my HA before connecting to the host. I ping my HA at 88ms, can I find any host below 88ms?..no. The hop from my HA to the host adds more ping, I find games at 130-150ms, so that means it takes me an extra 52+ms to find a host. My friends HA is in MN, virtually no ping hop, and for him to connect to the host is around 50ms. He finds games at 60ms.

               

              So lets say this happened using the local search option on  Black Ops, and we both get into a lobby, who is going to kill me first in stand down? Him for sure.

               

              Do you get it yet man...does your brain hurt?

               

              Black Ops did that to almost every player with local only option on, even worse on default, matched people up based on region not connection, which lead to the horrible hit detection.

               

               

              MW2's system made this happen a hell lot less, the only advantage a player would have is if he is the host, or a host invited a friend locally and he had a faster ping than the people having 150ms.

               

              Prove this completly wrong, then we will talk. Oh wait, you don't have to prove yourself because you think you are right...now that's ingnorant.

               

              Also I wouldn't be surprised if you maccabi is actually foxy's normal member account or something. You talk like him and everything, plus fox stopped commenting, did he just stop commenting...hmmmmm.

              • esmorgue Master
                esmorgue
                6,606 posts since
                Jul 9, 2011
                Currently Being Moderated
                Sep 26, 2011 5:07 PM (in response to dexter1992)
                Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                I cant understand something. If he is from the Box side, why is he over here. Dex ignore the PS2s competitor. You know they are going to be inlove with the matchmaking on Black Ops because confessed that our game was crap, and that they almost killed themselves making our game and released it full price as crap. I appreciate your help on many things, as well I hope others do.

                • iif0xh0undii GlobalModerator
                  iif0xh0undii
                  10,709 posts since
                  May 23, 2011
                  Currently Being Moderated
                  Sep 26, 2011 5:31 PM (in response to esmorgue)
                  I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                  That's entirely the wrong stance to take. Sub-forums aren't meant to be enforceable segregation. As much as someone may want it to be, no one person can stop others from posting in other forums if their discussion is contstructive.

                   

                  Dexter's perception on things is flawed and his only real defenses are that he's played the game online and that everyone else is just copy/pasting what a developer says. That's a position that one can't arguably stand on.

                   

                  The proper gist of this thread should have been that we needed an increase in visual information, despite relevance to all, which can help gamers understand what type of game they're being entered into. The matchmaking backbones are essentially the same and the only real differences are the types of variables they incorporate to create as best as possible of a connection.

                   

                  If you want to support Dexter that is fine. However he's really hurting his position by doling out insults and being extremely condescending. It's bad forum etiquette.

                   

                  I'm exiting this thread for the time being. In the future if more misconceptions are made elsewhere and I run across them I'm going to debate them and discuss as to why they should be put to a stop.

                  • dexter1992 Apprentice
                    dexter1992
                    1,113 posts since
                    Sep 21, 2011
                    Currently Being Moderated
                    Sep 26, 2011 5:42 PM (in response to iif0xh0undii)
                    Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                    That's fine by me, interesting how you are finally back. I know the matchmaking backbone is the same, I was talking about the variables this whole time. And I still don't see disproving of my reasoning, you can't accept it because I am not an official developer.  Whatever, it's not rocket science, and fyi I am taking networking/cisco right now in college all 72 credits over two years. I know a lot more than the average person.

                    • maccabi Master
                      maccabi
                      11,900 posts since
                      May 31, 2011
                      Currently Being Moderated
                      Sep 28, 2011 7:14 AM (in response to dexter1992)
                      Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                      In waddled the duck holding a sign that read "No I wont back down T.petty"...

                       

                      First off contary to your tinfoilhat theory fox and myself are one in the same (noticed you mentioned this again on another threads now), Nope sorry the fact we have both told you you are wrong and you are giving people misleading infomation is coincidental nothing more.

                       

                      Before you go off all defensive again I want to make it clear again as you keep missing this point, you do deserve props the stuff you have done over the last year to help ps3 users with setting up and faffing with their ps3's and i am in now way taking that away from you.

                      The point I keep trying to get across to you though is really not that much of a deal in the grand scheme of things , simply if you're going to make brash statements about stuff and you arent 100% certain say that , no one is going to think less of you if you say ok this is what I think or I have a theory

                      Ironically fox has told me almost the same before, albeit for a slightly different reason in posts I have made, asking me to add a disclaimer and although at the time I didnt really get what he meant (and if im honest rather childishly went slightly too far with some disclaimers ) on reading stuff back I could see he had a very valid point.

                       

                      Said this before as well but you are very similar to myself in as much as what you do for the ps3 community on the forums, I do the same on the xbox forums. This is why i mention the cult of dexter, you have people who listen to you and respect you , thats fine but when you post something and they all jump in defending you and your statements based solely on who you are thats where the problems start as you are stating things they are now taking as gospel.. This is a bad thing especially as these posts now show on the main forums lists and theres alot of new people comming here to read up on suff.

                       

                      My original points about how matchmaking works stand, in your defense over the entire p2p matchmaking issue i can see how you have gotten confused by the stealth clowns p2p matchmaking, I think you will find he isnt infact talking about a server model here (its a listen server) but on one possible parameter of matchmaking where its selected off player to player pings, not as a possible player to server ping and grouping everyone in the same ping range together. make sense?

                       

                      My next point is you're whole epeen issues they really dont help your cause and you took my lack of interest in giving my "credentials" as some sort of win for you , when it fact it was mostly as i said previously i prefer a level of anonymity and also if im honest as I wanted to avoid making you look even more of a muppet than you have managed yourself. Not really into the whole arrogance pro perk.

                      Here's an example

                      dexter1992 wrote:

                       

                      ....  Whatever, it's not rocket science, and fyi I am taking networking/cisco right now in college all 72 credits over two years. I know a lot more than the average person.

                       

                       

                      No dexter what you know is a few basic things about networks but scarily still cant tell the difference between really basic server models ?????, last time I checked cisco dont run specific game orientated modules (i might be wrong its been along time since I have seen the basic cisco cert courses) . This statement does nothing to help you prove a point but seeing as you want to play the show your cards game.

                       

                      You're what starting your entry level ccent or ccna certs right now right? I completed my ccent,ccna and ccnp a long time past and am now ccde and ccie (bns) cert'ed mostly as my bosses keep paying for me to do these things . To further my card anology you just went all in with a pair of deuces against my royal flush and lost matey.

                       

                      But lets be clear here none of  that matters in the slieghtest, as we are talking about how games work and the systems behind making them run ..

                      Unlike you I used to work in the games industry this is where my understanding and actual real life bone fide know what im talking about attitude comes from.

                      I will add never on a cod title but once you get into the gubbins of a cod game the basic arcitecture for online play is the same throughout. I was heavily into the pc modding community back in the day so have a very firm understanding of how it all works). I worked on various types of games and backend stuff related to online gaming, including one of the first sucessful java based mmos back in 1999 which I co wrote, various fps games based of id tech engines,and a couple of ports of games to xbl. I left the industry as I was getting disillusioned with where it was heading and as I got headhunted round the same time with as the expression goes " an offer i couldnt refuse " by my present employers.But i am still very active and interested in the backend parts of online gaming so to speak, due to there is crossovers to online gaming and to what i now currently do and obviously as i still am a geek/gamer at heart.

                       

                      Protip instead of constantly trying to go loggerheads with me and others, chillax abit and think before you type.

                       

                      The duck is now throughly bored still feeling hungover, and off for a paddle in the hotel pool in a now more comfortable 28 degree heat.

                      • dexter1992 Apprentice
                        dexter1992
                        1,113 posts since
                        Sep 21, 2011
                        Currently Being Moderated
                        Sep 28, 2011 7:27 AM (in response to maccabi)
                        Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                        I understand that you beleive that I should not post things that I am not 100% certain about. But I have what is called deductive resoning, I think for myself through experience, what other people say, and what background in knowledge I have. I don't care about getting props for a thread, I am not that guy if you knew me. The title was the basis of what I was trying to make. I wanted the MW2 system in which games took longer to find due to matching you with hosts in a ping level that matched your connection quality at that time rather than throwing you in a a match in the US because that is my region. I am just starting out, but I still understand how latency works.

                         

                        Fox suggested that a download of 1.4Mbps was a horrible speed to run COD when I am sure maccabie you know that is more than enough. Before I post this stuff I test it, I make my own conclusions that seem pretty resonable.

                         

                        They are not facts, but tell me, explain what in my explanation is false. Just like it is not fact that it's not how I say it is. We can go this circle all the time when trying to figure or reason.

                         

                        It may be your experience makes it so you don't want to admit if I was right, but non the less I just want MW3 to run good. This thread turned into more than I wanted. As it stands as with MW2 I know

                         

                        It pings the hosts at the coonection quality you have at that time...I tested it. Using deductive resaoning and mainly just common sense and understanding I know that almost everyone who hit find game who gets in my lobby has the same connection(ping) as me.

                         

                        BO I can't really say, but why a locale only setting, it's more flawed.

                         

                        Wether you want to back up BO, Treyarch, Fox or yourself I have no problem. Just explain why and back it up.

                         

                        And yes the difference between the basic server models is a bit foggy.

                        • maccabi Master
                          maccabi
                          11,900 posts since
                          May 31, 2011
                          Currently Being Moderated
                          Sep 28, 2011 8:39 AM (in response to dexter1992)
                          Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                          You're still missing my point i think, i'm not saying dont make posts with your assumptions/opinions or theories just make sure you are clear that you are posting them as such. ie a theory or an assumption/opinion.

                           

                          In regards to matchmaking you are presenting at best empirical evidence, , whether or not i or anyone agrees is by the by, same as your "deductive resoning". Do I personaly agree with some of the things you said no, does that make then invalid again no. My issue with your original post started when your first line read "I hope this video will give you guys a better understanding on which system was the best"

                           

                          It should have read on which system I THOUGHT was best. As what you are doing is not stating a fact but an opinion albeit one you then want on to back up and provide reasoning why as to why you kept to your own opinion. Personaly I think blackops system was better as it got you into matches faster, and unlike IW's experiment didnt completely backfire , as i said it took months till IW, through numerous patches and hotfixes managed to get matchmaking working well.

                          I did actually explain how games and platforms perform matchmaking and why stuff like local searching will never be exactly as how the majority of people assume local should be. This isnt to say i am defending 3arch nor that i am saying their system is better all i am saying is for me personally i prefered it.

                           

                           

                          another case in point on that other thread you said "

                          You can ask Foxhound he says BO=MW2 matchmaking it's the same, which it's not. Don't talk crap to him because then he will bring out his maccabe normal account and talk about ally McBeal or some crap, so he can say what he wants without hesitagion."

                           

                          The tinfoil hat part just makes you look like a chump and noone is going to take anything you say seriously when you come out with stuff like that., but to then say

                           

                          "To answer your question, MW3's matchmaking will be or even better than the MW2 system."

                           

                          you don't know that and to answer a question with such certainity isnt helping the guy who asked in the slightest nor other forum users again you are presenting your opinion as fact. and again trying to back it up with tyour own findings that if im honest and actually could be bothered to would blow so many holes into your reasoning you'd be sunk before half way thru reading (luckily for you I spared you that extra embarassment) as it is plainly obvious to anyone with half a brain why its flawed.

                           

                          I really dont care if im proved wrong and when i am happily admit to that straight off the bat, during my months of trying to tie down why blops has such inherent sync issues for some people(i do not never have suffered them)  i had quite a few theories as to why and provided proof where it was possible without falling foul of the rules of xbl or security of the game , Some of it i couldnt and pointed out it was a theory and as it turned out one thing i thought was causing it (elite) wasnt, and another (theatre) i was correct about having explainied the whole issue of extra game traffic to previous cods ect, for the record the validation was after 3arch explained why theatre turns off and doesnt record entire matches you can go search all that yourself.

                           

                          I have no interest in backing up 3arch, iw , or for that matter fox  , I just like seeing correct infomation posted and things given in the right context so as not to further confuse people.Dont read more into something than need be.

                           

                           

                          Protip for you, stuff like matchmaking you will NEVER get a straight answer to from a developer when it comes to explaining exactly how their own matchmaking third party system works with xbl's or psns systems. So basically anything anyone says is just educated guesses,. The only thing anyone can say with near on 100% accuracy is when explaining the basics of how each platform matchmakes.

                          • dexter1992 Apprentice
                            dexter1992
                            1,113 posts since
                            Sep 21, 2011
                            Currently Being Moderated
                            Sep 28, 2011 9:01 AM (in response to maccabi)
                            Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                            Well I don't care if you blow holes in my reasoning, I want you to.

                             

                            In the other thread the guy asked if MW3 will use what MW2 had, my links are proof. So yes I said it will be the same or better, assuming it can't be worse, backed up with the audio bit about reducing the bandwidth requirment. Also, if you listen to the audio bit, the guy explians that Black Ops had many features that increased the bandwidth requirement, he said thats what they think happened with Black Ops.

                             

                            The matchmaking on COD has flaws, which one has less to me would be MW2, and I explain why. I will continue to belive what I think is right, while you can believe yours.

                             

                            I think we both got mixed up in wording, as I was not trying to prove the backbone system but the in-game system used to match players. Weather it's P2P or not, I was always in the understanding that in gaming, where hosts are just everyday people with cable, and not a server it was P2P.

                            • JT235 Apprentice
                              JT235
                              322 posts since
                              Nov 11, 2011
                              Currently Being Moderated
                              Dec 23, 2011 8:15 AM (in response to dexter1992)
                              Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                              Is the MW3 matchmaking flawed? Yes. The fact that I am consistently put in to foreign rooms is an instant give away.

                               

                              Is matchmaking from previous COD better? Maybe but it has been a while since I have played MW2 and I do remember some issues. MW3 may be more in depth which may be the reasons for the issues.

                               

                              Personally with a P2P system it will be difficult to have a perfect matchmaking. Original Socom titles had the right idea. They had lobbies, US East, US Central, US West and so on. I went in to US Central because that is where I am at and most people that were there were from US Central. Was there lag? Yes but not what I see now and there was no chance I was in a EAU hosted room.

                               

                              I think to start they could region the game with version control. US = version 2.01, EAU = version 3.01 and so on. Version 2.01 cannot play with 3.01 so no chance of me being in a EAU hosted room. I understand people have friends from across the pond but that distance, I don't care how good your connection is, will create latency issues. But hey this makes to much sense and would never be done.

                • dexter1992 Apprentice
                  dexter1992
                  1,113 posts since
                  Sep 21, 2011
                  Currently Being Moderated
                  Sep 26, 2011 5:35 PM (in response to esmorgue)
                  Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                  All I have have to say to that, if you almost killed yourself making a game that ran as horrible as Black Ops, you need get the hell out of coding, and go back to college.

                • dexter1992 Apprentice
                  dexter1992
                  1,113 posts since
                  Sep 21, 2011
                  Currently Being Moderated
                  Sep 26, 2011 5:45 PM (in response to esmorgue)
                  Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

                  esmorgue you know as well as I do there is at least some truth to what I am saying, it's people like me and you who fight for the things that matter in cod, not "omg the famas is so over-powered..lol ahh the memories.

  • issy_i Calculating status...
    issy_i
    53 posts since
    Sep 25, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 26, 2011 5:20 PM (in response to dexter1992)
    Re: I Made a Video Showing the Different Matchmaking Systems, MW3 Needs The System From MW2! PLEASE!!!

    Lag Ops is a nightmare when it comes to connection

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