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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
operator-1 wrote:
The game lies to us - it shows us one thing on our screens, but then it seems to turn the clock back & do something else completely different.
We can't trust what the game decides to display on our screens because too often it contradicts what it's showing us.
It's to the point where I don't even enjoy my victories anymore because I'm not sure if I won by skill or if my opponents simply got screwed over by MW3's broken lag/sync problems.
Well it's called client-side prediction, or predictive rendering*, and it's designed to do this on purpose so that players of varying connection quality can still enjoy a smooth game. (This is part of what they added new in Black Ops.) That's why when you have a 2-bar in BO or MW3 the game still plays quite smoothly, but in MW2 it can feel nonresponsive like running through syrup.
What you have to understand is that the game MUST lie to you, purely for technical reasons, or it would become unplayable if the latency delta between players gets > 100ms or so. I can tell you as a network engineer and programmer that without these types of systems there could not be unstructured online multiplayer, pure and simple. You would need dedicated servers and each client would need to have latency within a ~25ms window to the server and to each other if you wanted a fair playfield without these systems.
Lag compensation and client prediction go hand in hand because while your client is waiting for the data packet with info on what everyone else is doing, the models need to keep moving on your screen unless you want people skipping frames across the screen.
*The faster paced the game is, the less predictable player movements are, and that's when the system starts to go pear shaped and you see people facing different directions in your live view vs killcam, etc.
I've also mentioned before that in user interface design you need timely positive acknowledgement of user action and that is why people get mad, because as you've said, what you see with your own two eyes is contradticted some seconds later by an unknown outside arbitrary process and this ticks people the wrong way. Properly implemented though these systems are designed to be unobtrusive and relatively unnoticed.
Now granted, the implementation of this in MW3 obviously has problems that the team is working on, but I can assure you that there is no way the system could be "reverted" to MW2 without major difficulty and we need to just take G IH A IN ID II at his word that this is their top priority. Maybe altogether different lag compensation and prediction systems can be implemented in a future game, but for now, they have to fix what they've got.
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
@ G IH A IN ID II
Did you get my PM about what the connection bars actually mean?
Also can you let us know what time tonight the latency changes are being made on xbox so that I can test and report back?
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
baddress wrote:
Well it's called client-side prediction, or predictive rendering*, and it's designed to do this on purpose so that players of varying connection quality can still enjoy a smooth game.
And this is what happens:
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
G IH A IN ID II wrote:
ilikedbomore wrote:
what about Drop zone, is it coming back?
Yes, and soon. You shouted, we listened.
Cheers,
G IH A IN ID II
I'm calling FOUL here!! Are you kidding me? Enough people screamed for Drop Zone to make a return (in the several days since it's disappearance) yet not enough people have made a request for more hardcore variants (HC:FFA for instance)?? Bollocks.
Or better yet, the ability to play the new maps (for which we PAID for) in game modes we actually want to play in (HC:moshpit is HORRIBLE). No one wants that.
Listened my ass. Sorry I don't mean to be rude, but that is horse puckey!
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
roachoutro wrote:
ilikedbomore wrote:
roachoutro wrote:
G IH A IN ID II!
Any news on fixing "lag compensation"? Tried couple of matches, behind like ~1second all the time. Did you find out what caused you in being "behind" when partying?
Its been three months and its still unplayable, i have been beta testing your game after every hotfix and every patch, we are running out of patience here. You should ask somebody where we can get our refunds.
Did you find out are all same patches released on MW2 PS3 & XBOX360?
Thank You.
join game, if u get killed, watch killcam, if what u see in killcam doesnt have anything u experienced with ur own eyes, leave game, search for other game, works for me!
then u can find good games, or tolerable games, where s just 1 guy with "lagvantage" so it s still playableDoesnt work like that for me, lag is horrible in almost every game. Would play Mw2 if it wasnt full of cheaters / hackers. (on PS3) It always worked perfectly. How can there be such huge step back? Shouldnt developement always take steps forward?
well i am on Xbox
hm try avoid lobbies with split screeners
so u can join mercenary
i usually play domination, team defender, because there s less players than in ground war
or mercenary game- Report Abuse
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
@G IH A IN ID II: I cannot understand how Activision gives solutions to improve online connectivity, yet the Developers of this games franchise punishes those of us that may have enacted that advice.
How is it equal to punish someone that doesn't have to follow mom and dads household rules. I am in control of my modem and router. As I have said, I pay for the internet. Why should I then be forced to have someone with red or yellow bars as this game indicates, dictate in some fashion how the game should run for those who have the wherewithal to do they best they can to not negatively impact the game, with crappy connectivity?
I cannot comprehend either how someone playing the game by himself can impact the games performance all by himself via his connection and console, yet 2people on 1console and 1 connection doesn't or wasnt discovered as doing so. I have clips of numerous SSners eating lead like a swine and not dying yet killing me.
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
The last update turned my bullets into spectral bullets.
I've seriously had enough.
The only time I play this game now is with a mate until after 2 or 3 games we get pissed off and put black ops on.
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
baddress wrote:
...What you have to understand is...
I do understand, but I also recognize that understanding the technicalities of implementation is not necessary to see that the user experience is utterly broken.
There is no technical description that can lull anyone into thinking that "what you see is not what you get" is an acceptable level of quality. What's the point of engaging in an interactive experience when your interactions are so frequently ignored/overridden?
There is no scientific explanation for "broken" that can make customers happily accept it & keep using it & say good things about it.
baddress wrote:
...Properly implemented though these systems are designed to be unobtrusive and relatively unnoticed...
100% agreed - and the problem we're making note of is the fact that it's not "properly implemented" in this case.
baddress wrote:
...there is no way the system could be "reverted" to MW2...
100% agreed. I don't expect them to revert (go backwards). I expect them to advance onto something better (move forward).
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
Franczez wrote:
Don't want to spam my posts but real need an answer to :
* What about the LMG ??? After Shotguns getting buffed, LMG are the next big thing to do. No one uses them. I personaly Loved RPD or AUG but now LMG are to weak to use

* I also think a Assault Juggernaut is not such powerful according to pointstreaks. Maby a flinch proficiency and a grip on the M60 would do the trick?
*Please response about the Cheating problem it KILLS the PC version, reports on stream are useless Is there a HOPE for any solutions of defence for \PC players? Maby a web site where we could post movies with aimboters and hackers?
*EMP last too long OR its too easy to get
*stealth bomber is too easy to get (for example on DOM its few flags few uav's down few frags and they are flying like crazy)
i am sorry but PC multiplayer is doomed for good
and i dont think anyone ever can fix that
especially when u can search for hacks or even clans have links on their forums
or there are even official forums of something called TeamKillingCommunity...
that s reason why i have xbox- Report Abuse
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Currently Being ModeratedRe: Modern Warfare 3 Title Update and Hot Fix Notes
RE: lag compensation, client prediction being necessary for games...
To a degree, from a technical point I could understand this. My only gripe to this is I have NEVER had issues like those I've experienced with BO and MW3 in ANY OTHER ONLINE GAME.
I don't recall Halo ever having issues like this.
With that said, I know lag exists and I have experienced lag itself in just about all online games. I recall having to lead my snipe shots in HALO. In fact it gave me more satisfaction having to do so as it felt like I was "somewhat skilled" at overcoming the lag.
The crap they have done for the NOOBS is unbearable and quite frankly ridiculous. If this concept existed in other games, the fact that I never felt it tells me those game makers were above and beyond better than TA's or IW's. That's not fair to say and I know that's not the truth.
Bottom line, TA and IW felt the need to try something new (for what reasons is unknown to me). I'm sticking by the fact that it's part of the latest trend to cater to more people (noobs) to bring down the intimidation factor of facing more experienced players.
BTW, I think Bungie's multiplayer system was genius and should have been employed everywhere. Matchmaking based on skill (whilst providing non-ranked playlists) provided me with the most competitive (and satisfying) experience I've ever had.
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