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3666 Views 46 Replies Latest reply: Jul 15, 2012 9:12 AM by xxphenomen4xx RSS
ghamorra Master 8,615 posts since
Sep 17, 2011

I'm not one to suggest pointsteaks, but if they do bring back Support here's what I'd like to see included

Posted by ghamorra on Jul 9, 2012 11:14 AM

Instead of adding a Stealth Bomber which is clearly not Support how about a pointsteak that bumps everyone on your teams pointsteaks by 1. This would be very effective for your team fulfilling the requirements of being supportive. It wouldn't directly kill the enemy team like the SB, but allow others to successfully do so. So I think it would make a great fit

3666 Views     
  • Moorningstar Novice 239 posts since
    Jun 28, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated

    I'll agree to that.  People complain about the idea of Support, but I thought it was a great way for noobs to still be able to enjoy killstreaks.  Not that everyone that used it was a noob.  Lots of people that just had that mentality used it to help their teammates.  But you are dead on that support killstreaks should not generate direct kills (ie. turrets, bombers, etc)  Support should buff allies and debuff enemies.  Think of them as the tank of the game, they don't kill much but the CC the hell out of the team and assist thier allies.  Despite what others say I think the Support idea was inspired.  Course this is coming from someone that almost always played Specialist so . . .

    • robbierocket Master 3,521 posts since
      May 31, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated

      The gun on gun, limited killstreaks promise never materialised (nor did, play the game the way you want to, because you were 2 seconds behind the game).

       

      The killstreaks should all be harder to achieve. Non-carrying streaks like Black Ops worked well. I wasn't a fan of the Support Streaks because it encourages senseless play (running around in TDM to get kills is not the objective. It's to get more kills than deaths).

       

      However, I would support Support if it was extremely tame support. Take out the bomber, the manual sentry and whatever else directly aggressive, and put in extra armour, ammo supply drops, portable radars and other equipment, double-sweep recons, tactical insertions, enemies appearing on minimap briefly if they get a kill, etc. The enemy team should be notified of the streak to reduce its effect.

        • robbierocket Master 3,521 posts since
          May 31, 2011
          Currently Being Moderated

          I find the MW3 community a neurotic fickle bunch of powerheadline seekers, all guts and glory and the like. Of course I was on there, spinning my Saturn rings of wisdom which went down like a meteor and disintegrated like a meteorite. I even reached close to biggest user before a plethora of fast guns blazed to remove me from the forum for (legally) posting 15 threads in a short space of time - well, an hour of so - about the issues with MW3.

           

          As it was off-peak time, people saw the forum full of back-to-back posts and accused me of spamming the forum.

           

          I was banned a week and barely returned after that. Then this pre-releasen forum started and I remebered which side I'm on, Treyarch's.

      • -pictureframe- Master 11,871 posts since
        Sep 21, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated

        robbierocket wrote:

         

        The killstreaks should all be harder to achieve. Non-carrying streaks like Black Ops worked well. I wasn't a fan of the Support Streaks because it encourages senseless play (running around in TDM to get kills is not the objective. It's to get more kills than deaths).

         

         

        In some cases it's different, though. When I play Domination I have my support streak on, because when I hop on B Flag there's no telling if an enemy will kill me. Support streaks encourage me to take the risk of capturing a flag, because I know I won't be penalized if I fail.

         

        Assualt streaks, on the other hand, are the opposite. The majority won't be trying to take a hotly contested B Flag because they could die easily and ruin their streak. I'm not saying that support streaks are perfect, I just want to show that there is abuse on both sides of the field. You have a very good point with your TDM example.

         

        As for the Stealth Bomber being a support streak, I think it ought to be kept that way. Here's a scenario: You are playing domination and you are killed while defending a flag. After spawning across the map, you use your Stealth Bomber to finish off the person, thus keeping the flag yours and helping the team. That's what support is, no?

        • QwertyBoredom Apprentice 1,033 posts since
          Nov 15, 2011
          Currently Being Moderated

          Pointstreaks will defently return and they should as for support itself I think that idea of support was a step in the right direction but IW screwed it up real bad with things like the stealth bomber, -pictureframe- I see the sense in your scenario i just think the SB is far more an agressive streak than a supportive one and i feel IW put in to the support section to increase its use, and also i think the EMP screwed it a little, I don't think the EMP itself is OP or anything i just think its to much for 18 points especally compaired to the other 18 pointstreaks you can get.

        • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
          Jun 11, 2012
          Currently Being Moderated

          This is one of the only reasons I condone it in Support. I have seen many times that thing save a flag we just took. Yet the opposition had a hoard going to it and get decimated. Other that, I think the kills shouldn't contribute unless they are Defense or Offense kill all other would just count towards total kills not streaks. Thats playing the objective.

            • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
              Jun 11, 2012
              Currently Being Moderated

              I still don't understand how the AH6 wasn't in Support.

                • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
                  Jun 11, 2012
                  Currently Being Moderated

                  That what's ridiculous. The AH6 is a support chopper. It follows you around wherever you go picking off available targets who are coming your way.

            • -pictureframe- Master 11,871 posts since
              Sep 21, 2011
              Currently Being Moderated

              That's true, but to a lesser extent. A regular airstrike gives the enemy warning to move away. A predator can also be seen, and even destroyed if the right equipment is used. But when you target a flag (or any other objective for that matter) with a Stealth Bomber, their chances of surviving are much less. This is why I classify it under support - you're given the oppurtunity to help your team.

               

              As for the AH6... that could be classified under support if you lead it to defend an objective. Though it is every bit as "agressive" as the SB, which is what many critics argue is wrong with it being a support streak.

              • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
                Jun 11, 2012
                Currently Being Moderated

                I see it more balanced than the SB. It can provide you a chance, and someone else to make it the objective to cap faster. Also, it can be shutdown easily by the opposition. I would probably run Support if it were in there. I love the thing. One of the best thing brought to CoD recently.

                • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
                  Jun 11, 2012
                  Currently Being Moderated

                  I agree. It sucked bad. It was even worse than W@W version. I would like to see it as viable source. It was barely even a deterrent.

                • -pictureframe- Master 11,871 posts since
                  Sep 21, 2011
                  Currently Being Moderated

                  The mortar team was a good idea but it was too slow to hit targets and had very small range. I'd definitely welcome a buff for BO2.

  • wridtrvlr Master 2,786 posts since
    Jan 27, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated

    I'm with you 1,000% ghamorra.  The killstreak you mention would be fabulous and I'm sure your team would appreciate it as well.  How nice to be one off a pavelow, only to have the support guy on your team get that last kill needed to help bump you up!! 

     

    Support is meant to support your team.  I've said it over and over, anything that kills is not supporting your team, but only helping yourself. 

  • robbierocket Master 3,521 posts since
    May 31, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated

    There is also the possiblility that some killstreaks/pointstreak rewards will appear in both/more reward packages (if the game has them). For example, I liked the AH6 and wanted it in Assault but it could have also been a high Support streak too.

     

    Stealth Bomber should never have been in Support because it can be used so aggressively in situations that are not defensive or supportive. There could have been so many other streaks to protect a flag than bomb the hell out of it. It's especially unrealistic as a manoeuvre in that setting too. I know that the game is just a game but the more silly stuff there is puts me off it - Bombing your own base!?

     

    Instead there could have been tripwire explosives, perimeter mines, base sensors, auto-tactical insertions (acting as reinforcement drop or insertion), fixed area AH6, and so on...

    • -pictureframe- Master 11,871 posts since
      Sep 21, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated

      The realism argument has been out the window for years. We have exploding RC Cars and helicopters that can be shot out of the sky with tomahawks, not to mention walking tanks and dual-wield Mac11s. Besides, blowing things up is what CoD is all about!

       

      You do have a point about better support streaks that could be in the game. Remember how in BO you could assign a place for your attack chopper to hover around? I think that should make a return; it was useful for putting over the B Flag on a game of domination, or on a high traffic Bomb Site in demolition.

      • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
        Jun 11, 2012
        Currently Being Moderated

        Now there is something I liked.

      • robbierocket Master 3,521 posts since
        May 31, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated

        It's a sliding bar with realism. You say it's out of the window but I don't see flying pink elephants. Likewise there's a certaim level of believability and there has to be, hence weaponary loadout, player running speed, building scale, environments, etc.

         

        RC Cars was an experiemental thing and they were actually made (should never have been a main killstreak, but assigned to the Care Package where Death Machine and Grim Reaper were found). In fact, the frequency and regularity of their threat was the absurdity, not their existance in a game based on 60s/70s black operations.

         

        Tomahawks taking down helicopters was a game physics glitch that was never amended. Tomahawks in general were BS over a range beyond 5 metres.

         

        Walking tanks? Never seen them in a COD that has been released. If you mean Black Ops 2, I think you cannot make any valid point on that until game context, actual mechanics and so on have been experienced. It is set in the near future and you are aware of robots, right? Treyarch have continually stated that the technology is already here and this is fiction, not science fiction. It's a possible future, even if it isn't a likely one. The lack of likeliness is to do with the WW3 scenario being played out to motivate such technology.

        Ps. Just think of the technology involved in you playing COD online, and then conversing with me now.

         

        Dual-wielding Mac11s is a bit of an OP issue. I've seen a ton of dual-wielders of machine pistols and SMG's in the movies, the problem is while physically possible it's inaccurate and inefficient, even dangerous in a multitude of settings.

         

        So, that's the realism over. COD is not real and many things are far from it, but that doesn't mean using a lack of realism as free licence is going to justify anything or make a game better. Stealth Bomber on your own flag is unappealling for me, and that's why the damage counts against the player using it (even if on core modes the team is immune to damage).

        • Moorningstar Novice 239 posts since
          Jun 28, 2012
          Currently Being Moderated

          I'd like to point out that what treyarch should have said is not that the walking tanks etc are real and thus this is fiction, but that they are in development (which of course makes this SF, which I love btw).  GRFS can claim its not SF but it is.  Its using tech that doesnt exist yet, although most of it is in development, and has been for years.

      • Moorningstar Novice 239 posts since
        Jun 28, 2012
        Currently Being Moderated

        um the exploding rc car is real.  The first huey could be taken out with a rock.  Not sure how you think thats not realistic

  • vims1990 Master 7,495 posts since
    Aug 13, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated

    I will support the "support package" if they don't add pointstreaks not to kill but just to support your teammates.

     

    Pointstreaks such as Ballistic Vests, UAV's, Recon Drones, Sam Turrets are all support

    Pointstreaks such as the Stealth Bomber, Remote Sentry, Recon Juggernaut are Assault, they're specifically designed to kill so they should be Assault.

     

    Yes, we can classify pointstreaks such as the AH6 Overwatch as supporting your teammates BUT it kills.

     

    The support & assault package all support your teammates but they support your teammates differently.

    • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
      Jun 11, 2012
      Currently Being Moderated

      Well.well..well.. I see your point. I just see the AH6 as a support because it is more balanced for the user and the enemy. Stealth Bomber I despise and see no point of it in Support. It cannot be countered other than by EMP.

  • robbierocket Master 3,521 posts since
    May 31, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated

    Assault should be classified as standard and include things like...

    3 - UAV

    4 - Counter UAV

    5 - Package, Napalm, Artillery, Predator Missile, I.M.S.

    6 - Sentry Gun, Valkyrie Rockets, Precision Airstrike

    7 - Stealth Bomber, Attack Chopper, Remote Turret

    8 - Strafe Gun, Assault Drone, Sam & Sentry (2 packages)

    9 - SR-71, Chopper Gunner, Little Bird Guard

    10- Reaper, Pavelow

    11- Dogs, Gunship

    12- Escort Airdrop, AC130

    14- Osprey Gunner

    15- Juggernaut

     

    If Support exists then it should be named as it is and include things like...

    4 - Ammo Crate (whole team)

    5 - Ballistic Vests

    6 - UAV

    7 - Counter UAV

    8 - Equipment Crate (whole team)

    10- Sam Turret, Contact Recon (hitmarkers reveal enemies as red dot for 1 second)

    12- Recon Drone

    15- Juggernaut Recon

    25- Airdrop, EMP, SR-71

     

    The enemy team should always be notified of a Support streak being activated to reduce its effect.

    • machine2011 Master 2,976 posts since
      Oct 21, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated

      25 kills for a airdrop, emp and sr-71 sounds like to much plus why shouldnt someone using support  get a streak that gets them a kill or 2 since they are the people that are more likely doing all the the work by capping flags and stuff.

       

      as for the recon drone i want the one from that new spec ops map then one where you have to destroy the russian ship but give it limited ammo and give it a over heat function that kicks in after 10 shots

      • robbierocket Master 3,521 posts since
        May 31, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated

        My focus was on TDM, but perhaps the pointstreaks should be varied for different game modes - I only just thought of that. For example, standard Mortar or Artillery, 3-4 kills in TDM but 5-6 kills in CTF?

         

        Thoughts?

      • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
        Jun 11, 2012
        Currently Being Moderated

        GW makes the EMP worse.

          • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
            Jun 11, 2012
            Currently Being Moderated

            I have played it regularly since CoD4. I can deal with it when it isn't as bad as MW3. Black Ops was bad but not as bad. Thought the filth is rampant throughout all modes.

    • vims1990 Master 7,495 posts since
      Aug 13, 2011
      Currently Being Moderated

      robbierocket wrote:

       

      Assault should be classified as standard and include things like...

      3 - UAV

      4 - Counter UAV

      5 - Package, Napalm, Artillery, Predator Missile, I.M.S.

      6 - Sentry Gun, Valkyrie Rockets, Precision Airstrike

      7 - Stealth Bomber, Attack Chopper, Remote Turret

      8 - Strafe Gun, Assault Drone, Sam & Sentry (2 packages)

      9 - SR-71, Chopper Gunner, Little Bird Guard

      10- Reaper, Pavelow

      11- Dogs, Gunship

      12- Escort Airdrop, AC130

      14- Osprey Gunner

      15- Juggernaut

       

      If Support exists then it should be named as it is and include things like...

      4 - Ammo Crate (whole team)

      5 - Ballistic Vests

      6 - UAV

      7 - Counter UAV

      8 - Equipment Crate (whole team)

      10- Sam Turret, Contact Recon (hitmarkers reveal enemies as red dot for 1 second)

      12- Recon Drone

      15- Juggernaut Recon

      25- Airdrop, EMP, SR-71

       

      The enemy team should always be notified of a Support streak being activated to reduce its effect.

      Remove any form of UAV's in the Assault Package in my opinion.

      In the support package, put both the UAV & the Counter UAV as a 6th pointstreak. I think there should be choice  between the UAV & Counter UAV.

       

      Reduce as much UAV spam in the game. It's a reason why Stealth Perks are widely used amongst the community.

       

      I'd like to see more flexibility in BO2 when it comes to perk choice. Due to the amount of UAV & Portable Radar spam in MW3, I feel like I have to Assassin all the time which I don't enjoy.

      • ChestSplittah Master 8,724 posts since
        Jun 11, 2012
        Currently Being Moderated

        I'm sorry Vims, I can't even agree with the widely used comment. It's widely used because there truly is no other perks to use over them.  No other CoD other than Black Ops had these issues and they had UAV. The first 2 CoDs on these consoles only had 3 KS. MW2  had UAV and a CB. It wasn't abused or used as much even with the chainable streaks involved. Even without it CB being broken up.

        • vims1990 Master 7,495 posts since
          Aug 13, 2011
          Currently Being Moderated

          ChestSplittah wrote:

           

          I'm sorry Vims, I can't even agree with the widely used comment. It's widely used because there truly is no other perks to use over them.  No other CoD other than Black Ops had these issues and they had UAV. The first 2 CoDs on these consoles only had 3 KS. MW2  had UAV and a CB. It wasn't abused or used as much even with the chainable streaks involved. Even without it CB being broken up.

           

          I'm won't disagree over what you stated above esmourge.

           

          MW3 is just too easy to get UAV's compared to previous COD titles especially with the support package & the pointstreak system and there isn't a decent second tier perk in MW3 that competes well with Assassin. Also portable radar equipment has become my frustration in not using a perk to hide me from Portable Radar.

           

          I can't stand them, I'm unable to maneuver around the map without being detected by those equipment.

          This is what I have to deal with when I'm not using Assassin:

           

           

          I'd be happy if a perk like Sitrep Pro or Dead Silence protected me from portable radar whilst I can use a Stinger to take out UAVs when not using an Assassin perk.

           

          If BO2 makes it harder to attain UAV's & removes the portable radar equipment, it'll allow more flexibility in perk choice.

          Put Blind Eye & Assassin separately in the same perk tier so you choose between not showing up on radar or not being killed by air support.

  • Moorningstar Novice 239 posts since
    Jun 28, 2012
    Currently Being Moderated

    I'll say it again Support should SUPPORT THE TEAM.  It should not kill but make it easier for your team (and yes you) to kill.  Since deaths dont stop streaks I can easily see putting uavs higher in the tree, but they should only be available in support.  If your worried about your points consider that you should get assist points every time your ks helps kill someone.  If you put a uav up and your team kills someone.  If you drop an ammo box and an ally reloads.  Anytime someone picks up a ballistic vest, anytime they kill someone while close to death and wearing a bv.  Hell take a page from GRFS and let support hack the enemy as a ks.  get major points everytime an enemy is killed while thats active.  Give them traps that slow the enemy down, or make them spawn in specific areas, or illuminate an enemy as the spawn.  Let them show thier team where all enemy equipment is (for a limited time only).  Keep the remote sentry in but remove the turret and let it highlight enemies that you see with it on allied huds.  There are plenty of things that could make a support ks very worthwhile to the team other then just killing enemies.  Hell when I ran it i ran uav ballistic vest sam turret, cause it just seemted to me that that was how it should work.

  • xxphenomen4xx Apprentice 936 posts since
    Jul 22, 2011
    Currently Being Moderated

    if they do the same type of style, i hope they don't include recon plane in assault kill streaks!

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