Not really balanced. Shotguns are incredibly powerful weapons in real life. If they gave shotguns 40+ meters of range and kept everything else the same there would be a lot of problems. The aa12 would be the best gun in the game because in real life it puts out the same damage per shell as a pump shotgun would but at like 350 rpm. I think the range for the shotguns in mw3 is relatively good. Its only the damage values that need to be changed.
Yeah that would definatly not work. That's the whole thing with shotguns, close range you should dominate if you're good, and at long range you should not be able to kill anyone. Which obviously isn't the case in MW3, shotguns do not dominate at close range except the Striker.
A few days ago I was playing SnD and I was using the Spas again, I came up to the side of someone and he was not moving AT ALL I aimed down sights my aim was dead on and I got a hitmarker. I can not use anything besides the Striker anymore. IW, buff the shotguns!
I find the USAS12 better then the striker for me i can get plenty of one shot kills at close to medium range even in core mode, and hardcore it is deadly. Most people seem to over look it because of a slow fire rate, I use extreme conditioning Assasin pro and dead silence pro with it. If you can hip fire accuratley with it your enemy does not stand a chance at close range and using dead silence and extreme conditioning you can get close to them quickly and without them hearing you. I tried the striker but find it difficult to get one shot kills compared to the USAS i have lost count of the times i have run into a room with three people hiding out and wasted them all with one shot each.I woulddefinetely advise attaching the grip and range on it then it lays waste in close quarters combat and is perfect for dome and arkhaden.
When you use the Striker you shouldn't expect 1 hit kills. But with damage you get alot of 2-3 hit kills. I definatly think the Striker is the best shotgun because of it's fire rate and it's pretty consistant.
Depending on the map I use Range or Damage and always extended mags because if you don't fire super fast the Striker doesn't ave alot of recoil
here is what I don't understand. We know there is a problem with shotguns. The video evidence shows that they have a fail rate much higher than any other weapon category in mw3. The frequency and quantity of videos displaying some very blatant hitmarkers shows this. So we know shotguns have a problem.
We know from the films where these hitmarkers happen when the shotgun has the damage proficiency on that it usually displays 2 pellets worth of damage hit the target. This is the case in 80+% of my videos of cqc hitmarkers with the shotguns and makes up a large majority of the other cases I have seen as well. Making the pumps strong enough so the damage proficiency will turn them into a 2 pellet kill before the damage drop makes it so those hitmarkers where only 2 pellets landed turn into kills leading to 80% of those bad hitmarkers to turn to kills as they should have. So we know what we are asking for fixes the problem.
We know what we are asking for is balanced because we have had the exact same close range damage we are asking for before in mw3. For the first 3 months of this game the spas with damage and emags glitch only required 25% of its pellets to kill before the damage drop. For three months we had the exact thing we are asking for. Do you know how many people thought that amount of close range damage was too strong? No one. In fact there is not a single thread on this forum or even on a google search that even suggested that this close range damage was a problem. In the 3 months of exposure to the pre 1.08 spas not one thread was created anywhere to complain about its close range damage. So by this we know that what we are asking for is still balanced in mw3.
We also know from my time gathering stats from peoples elite profiles that the 3 manual actions and the aa12 are among the very lowest performing weapons in mw3 in terms of k/d and for most people total kills. I am willing to bet that the striker and usas account for more than 50% of all shotgun usage. The 3 manual actions and the aa12 are extremely rare sights. The total shotgun usage might be to your desired numbers but individually the 4 listed are rarely used. From what I have gathered from elite profiles the 4 shotguns listed have a very low average k/d, therefore they also have a high death per minute, and therefore have a low average life. This coupled with their limited overall use and you have no reason not to buff them by your own criteria. The 4 shotguns in question perform worse than almost any other weapon in mw3 and they are rare sights in multiplayer.
Our logic is very sound on this matter ghandi. It is undeniable that there is a problem with shotguns, our proposal fixes that problem with minimal effort required and little impact on overall performance of the weapons, and we know what we are asking for does not upset the balance of mw3 because of our 3 months of experience with the pre 1.08 spas and the community's reaction to it. Our proposals will not lead to more total shotgun users by a noticeable margin. The opportunity cost of taking a shotgun over an AR or Smg is too high for most people to accept. The primary effect this will have is to make people move away from the usas and striker and use more of the other shotguns.
Your team is balancing these weapons based on their feelings towards them and not on what we as the shotgun community has been able to prove.
This is not fair, this should never happen.
All of these videos are from one 10 game session played this week. This is the current state of your shotguns.
The sheer fire rate of the other mw3 primaries insures their reliability. I have never seen a video of an smg failing as hard as the shotgun videos above. You have to agree that especially the 2 where I ads dead center on the guy is some extremely epic bs. I would challenge you to come up with a video of an smg, ar, or lmg that is so blatantly bad as the ones posted above.
The difference between smg's and shotguns come down to fire rate - the reason that they don't appear to fail as much is because you can keep 'spraying' and hopefully get enough bullets to register or synch with the enemy. I find though that the slower firing automatics (like CM901 for example) have a few more 'fails' than PP90M1 so something that fires at 10% of the fire rate of the CM901 (like the KSG), the lag/synch issue is going to have much more of an impact on it. I could be wrong of course.
The video of you against the M60 shows that you missed the majority of the body (low and to the left (his right)) but even though that M60 should have killed you in 2 shots from that range - it took quite a few more! I had an example of something similar with a (buffed) LSW that should take 3 hits at any range yet the killcam (and vault video) clealy shows that I hit the guy 7 times (I hit him 3 times then got hit off target as he fired at me and then landed a subsequent 4 bullets as I got back on target! I had a match earlier where a guy was running straight at me so I ADS my Scar and fired at him. After nearly empty my clip 20-25 bullets, he stabbed me and got the kill! I cannot believe that all those bullets didn't kill him or at least sufficient percentage of them and it wasn't as if he was zig-zagging either. I could go on and on with examples.
A lot of your videos also show a lot of 1 shot kills and some at good distance too. I do agree that the ones where you ADS look as though they should have killed BUT that could be down to the Lag/Synch issue and not the shotgun as it clearly works sometimes too.
I used to love using Shotguns in previous CoD games and admit the pump & lever action shotguns do leave me frustrated in MW3. I am more than willing to defend and support your call to BUFF them if they are as inconsistent AFTER they have fixed the lag/synch issue. I think it may well be too difficult to ascertain true weapons performance (shotguns or any other) until this is fixed - maybe that is why they can't replicate your problems in the development studio. Maybe it would be wiser to ask them to get the lag/synch issue fixed first and see if that resolves these issues we are all having with the weapons.
Just a thought....
As I said I (and probably the whole community) would support your call to buff them if they are still as unreliable and inconsistent after they fix the lag.
The sheer fire rate of the other mw3 primaries insures their reliability. I have never seen a video of an smg failing as hard as the shotgun videos above. You have to agree that especially the 2 where I ads dead center on the guy is some extremely epic bs. I would challenge you to come up with a video of an smg, ar, or lmg that is so blatantly bad as the ones posted above.
There is a difference, that is from a pvr not the ingame theater mode. Theater mode shows what the game says actually happened. If I had a pvr you could see all the crap hitmarkers I get and not just the ones that theater mode shows. My videos show that the game says I was on target and those shots still didn't count. Show me some theater mode that is that bad and then we can get somewhere but what you are seeing there is just the difference between what you see and what the game says happened.
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