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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 1:23 AM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
u can one shot one kill with the dragunov just gotta shoot closer to the chest just like all snipers
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 1:29 AM (in response to JelySickLe)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
No you can't. You can only get a OSOK to the neck and head with the Dragunov. >_>
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 2:32 AM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
I very much agree. The Dragunov was much more powerful in Black Ops and Call of Duty 4. I don't understand why even a HEADSHOT with a suppressor doesn't kill.
~RUGGED SAVIOR- Report Abuse
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 8:20 AM (in response to thebiindsniper)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
More opiinions please!! This needs to be addressed!
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 8:43 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
It doesn't need to be buffed. Everyone's just approaching the weapon with the wrong mindset. They're using like they would a dragunov from other games, but try seeing it as a completely new weapon. If you look statistically at the RSASS and the Dragunov, they are exactly the same when it comes to power (lower than other games) and rate of fire (a higher RoF than in other games). The RSASS, however, has less recoil than the dragunov, and a larger clip. But one thing the Dragunov has is mobility. Seeing as with the RSASS you move like a tank (the exact speed as a LMG), the dragonuv covers close- to mid-range encouters with the perfect speed and fluidity that the RSASS cannot.
My video on the subject: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6MjaJcsTlw
PS as for the gameplay trailer, the way the MSR user fell backward suggests a headshot, not a chest shot. He also could have been damaged beforehand. Or they buff that up to make it look cinematic, because they wanted to show the Dragunov but also not have an awkward 2-shot kill in their cinimatic sequence.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 11:12 PM (in response to dfernow)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
All I'm asking is to make it just as powerful as it was in COD4 and BO! Forget anything about buffing the Dragunov other tha giving it a OSOK to the chest w/out a silencer, and OSOK to the headn and neck w/ a silencer, like it's BO variant. Is that really so hard to ask?
And the RSASS not only has less recoil AND 2X the mag size, but it has a much faster reload and draw/raise times as well!!! They are both equal in power, but It outclasses the Dragunov in EVERY WAY, except for movement speed, which the Drag has an edge over, which doesn't mean crap really.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmWEaU8N7NeddEprUWFkQi1ZWFU0eGItNGw zZG1oSXc#gid=0
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 18, 2012 9:37 AM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
Watch the video. I show how that movement speed allows it to be superior over ever other sniper. As for the reload and aim times of the weapons you need to check your info. Every sniper rifle scopes in .40 seconds. As for the reload speed, the RSASS reloads in 2.70 sec, the dragunov in 2.75. That's a very negligible 0.05 sec difference.
The reason the Dragunov is superior to the RSASS is because with it's horrible mobility the only thing the RSASS can do effectively is sit back and be used like a Bolt-Action, a role ill-suited to a 2-shot sniper. The dragunov can pick up where the RSASS can't and be used in a mobile short-range combat sniper.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 18, 2012 6:16 PM (in response to dfernow)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
I never said anything about ads times on sniper rifles.
& look at Drag vs RSASS's normal, empty, and add reload times, as well as raise/drop times
Drag/RSASS
normal 2.75/2.7,
empty 3.5/2.95,
add 1.75/2.40,
raise 1.15/0.90,
drop 0.85/0.55
RSASS's empty time is a full .5 sec faster, and the add reload time is even more. Also look at raise and drop times. .25 seconds difference in raise and .30 seconds difference in drop is HUGE. And take the fact that RSASS has 2X the mag size of Dragunov (10 vs 20) as well!
At least with the AS50 vs teh Barret, the AS50 had a slightly faster normal reload time, but it's still outclassed in other empty, and raise/drop times, as well as mag size of course.
There's absolutely NOTHING the Dragunov can do, that the RSASS can't, other than have slightly faster movement speed--but the rSASS can match the Dragunvo's speed with speed proficiency anyway. Meanwhile, the RSASS outclasses the Dragunov in every other way it isn't equal in (power and RoF).
And sitting back? Because of the Dragunov's recoil, there's nothing you can do but forced to be stationary and go prone like a sitting duck. And if you want to get a head or kneck OSOK, there's more prep time involved lining up your target. You don't have to do that with the RSASS. You can get 2 shots at a long distance target consecutively, relaively easy while standing up.
Seriously, how in the world can people actually defend that Dragnov is superior to the RSASS? This is beyond me.. I've mained the Dragunov in COD4, BO, and currently doing so in MW3, andI know this.. You guys are seriously delusional.
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Currently Being ModeratedMar 4, 2012 7:36 PM (in response to dfernow)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
The Dragonuv has more recoil and less ammo than the RSASS. Normally, like in previous CoD games, that would be fine. But the Dragonuv also has less damage. Being a one hit kill ONLY in the head. Treat the gun any way you want, but it's underpowered and moving faster is hardly an advantage when the RSASS is better in every other way.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 9:31 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
And who are you to say how the gun was intended to be used? Are you the developer of the game? No? So I guess you do not know how they intended the gun to work. And how they intended the gun to work does not have to match how you think it should work and never does nor ever will.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 11:11 PM (in response to trialstardragon)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
I already gave some evidence to how it was most likely NOT intentional to have the Dragunov as weak as it is now. There's no reason to nerf an average sniper rifle for no reason, and the 1.1x chest multiplier, suggest to me that it was originally supposed to OSOK to the chest(could have originally had 98 damage instead of 70).
People asked to buff the shotguns, and to nerf the fmg9, and type95, and IW listened. So what does that tell you? It's possible, if we get enough people to support this. Like I said to the person before me.. Forget about buffing the Dragunov in every other way, I just want it to be as powerful as it was in COD4 and Bo. Which isn't asking much. Because now I can see that if it does get the chest multplier OSOK, it can be a dcent viable alternative against the Barrett, since it does have a faster reload time and movement speed against the Barrett, while the barrett has the stomach multiplier w/out silencer (and OSOK down to the chest w/ silencer), and slightly faster draw/raise times. But if people can learn to aim with the Dragunov to the chest and up, they won't have to rely on the stomach.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 17, 2012 11:19 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
You know what i just realized? IF the Drag gets the same power as its BO variant, which is OSOK all the way down to the chest w/out a silencer(same as COD4), and OSOK to the head and neck w/ silencer, it will actually be a pretty viable sniper rifle and be a decent choice alternative to the Barrett!
How?
The Barret currently has the stomach OSOK w/out silencer, and OSOK to the chest w/ silencer, as well as faster raise times..
In contrast, the the Dragunov has the advantage of a faster reload time, and a faster movement speed.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmWEaU8N7NeddHNhUlJxZ3RMd1NnVUVDNEt mYUR4SWc#gid=0
Thing is.. If you can train yourself aim, you don't need to rely on the stomach multiplier to get kills. The chest and up is already a big enough area! Then leaves the advantage of a faster movement speed.. What's left is that the barret will have slightly faster raise/drop times, and the more bigger advantage--a OSOK area to the chest VS ideally, BO version's Dragunov's OSOK to the head and neck.
So, at least when compared to w/out a silencer, the Dragunov is actually a decent viable alternative to use against the barrett! The barret will outclasses it overall, mainly due to the huge chest OSOK mutliplier w/ silencer, but it would remain as a decent option, and honestly.. I'd be just happy with that. I just want BO Dragunov!
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Currently Being ModeratedMar 3, 2012 5:29 AM (in response to trialstardragon)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
So, you're suggesting that they intended for the Dragunov to be utterly useless compared to Remington SASS and M14, and NOTHING like the Dragunov in MW1 and MW2?
Good call!
I am sure lots of fans enjoy using useless weapons!
The sheer number of people using Desert Eagle and Dragunov is overwhelming!
Upgrading the P90 to deal as much damage as the MP5, with less recoil and a faster rate of fire was also a stroke of genius.
The sheer number of people challenging themselves by using Dragunov and MP5s is overwhelming!
But...
I wonder.Apart from M16 and M60, MP5 and Dragunov are some of the few weapons to have remained in the MW series since MW1.
*Why* make these iconic weapons useless and further distance the game from CoD4: MW?
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 18, 2012 10:00 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
I agree.
It's recoil is good as it is, but it does not make sense to a Sniper to be a (most ocasions) 2 hit kill weapon and at the same time, having a Magazine so small. A chest kill would make it good enough, since it would require some accuracy from the user.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 18, 2012 11:14 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
Or... Just leave it as it is. If you don't like the gun then don't use it. Dragunov is one of the few guns in this game that takes some skill to use. Kinda like the KSG-12 Pre patch.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 19, 2012 3:48 PM (in response to Orihamu)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
Have you been reading anything I've said this whole time?
I LOVE the gun, and have since COD4. But this ridiculous nerfing on MW3 just made it really bad. Usable, but not nearly as effective as the other sniper rifles in most to all situations. It's outclassed by a large margin..
Oh and here is something interesting.. Someone from the Denkirson Probards, mentioned proposing to give the Dragunov 2.0X multipliers to the head, neck,and chest. Thus it would be like the sniper from COD4, where it didnt' need stopping power to kill in the chest (unless against juggernaut users), and it would kill in the head, neck, and chest w/out a silencer or with. I think this proposition is pretty interesting, because it would buff the Dragunov a whole lot more than I intended to, and it would be on par/level with the Barret. What do you guys think?
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Currently Being ModeratedMar 3, 2012 5:34 AM (in response to Orihamu)Re: Infinity Ward, PLEASE patch the Dragunov to the chest w/out silencer + head and neck w/ silencer as originally intended!!!
I thought the RSASS was supposed to be the try-hard weapon?
Statistically Challenged weapons:
AR: M16
SMG: MP5Sniper: RSASS and Dragunov
LMG: I've not even touched these and have not been killed by these except when juggernaut drops out of a care package, so I nominate the entire category except M60.
Shotgun: Spas 12 (The 1887s perform slightly better in all scenarios)- Report Abuse
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 20, 2012 2:13 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
please fix this gun I played with this gun since cod 4 and i love it make ik better!!
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 20, 2012 8:09 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
Slap an acog and speed on that baby and go to work. i got a 5 man clutch last night with the dragunov and found my favorite search gun. I know there are alot better weeapons and its a challenge to use but i hope they buff it up some. that would awesome.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 21, 2012 12:12 AM (in response to Cummins12valve)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
=
Guys.. I need your support now! All of you that supported me in this thread, and the people who are about to read this for the first time.. If you really want the Dragunov to be patched, to make it usable in this game like it's COD4/BO versions, please support me here, as I am addressing this DIRECTLY to an IW developer who is working on patches:
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 21, 2012 3:21 AM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
I support either:
-98 base damage (70 suppressed)
-2x head
-2x neck
-1.1x chest
OR
-70 base damage (50 suppressed)
-2x head
-2x neck
-1.4x chest
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 21, 2012 4:24 AM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
I agree silenced OHK to the head. But as for the rest I don't. It doesn't recoil enough to allow such high damage.
Though I understand you point of view, I don't agree with a buff except silenced.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 21, 2012 4:30 AM (in response to Pinquii)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
Maybe they meant for it to be a hardcore sniper?
I find it almost useless in core but in hardcore it seems to be a pretty good sniper.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 21, 2012 9:57 AM (in response to man-of-fear)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
. You're better off with the MK14 in hardcore mode. Dragunov has no niche in this game whatsoever. Also, most people play core, including me.
At least it has the niche of being the best silenced sniper rifle n BO, as all the snipers in BO, OSOK'd to the head and neck w/ silencer, which gave Dragunov an edge over the others when using silencer attachment, due to largest mag size/fastest reload times/draw-raise times, and Higher RoF(tied with PSG1 and WA2000). Most people couldn't play competively with silencer attachment though, or did nearly as well as w/out a silencer. You sacrifice a huge kill area (chest), for stealth, especially for the L96 and PSG1, which also had stomach multipliers and 2x as less mag size, and it didn't benefit much from that.
In contrast, in this game.. All the high power sniper rifles OSOK to the chest w/ silencer, while RSASS and Drag don't even have a head or neck OSOK w/ silencer. RSASS is understandable due to the low recoil and huge mag size, but the Drag? a moderately high recoil w/ low power and small multipliers=absolutely ridiculous.
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Currently Being ModeratedFeb 21, 2012 9:56 AM (in response to Pinquii)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
Pinquiii, you are forgetting the fact that the Dragunov in thiis game, functionally, has exactly THE SAME stats as the COD4/BO versions (i.e. same mag size, reload time, raise/drop times,, recoil, and recoil pattern), but unlike those 2 Dragunov variants, it's missing an OSOK to the chest w/out a silencer(and head and neck w/ silencer in BO).The Dragunov from COD4/BO was far far from broken. Most if not all of the veteran sniper community since COD4, know that that Dragunov has been the jack of all trades sniper rifle in each of those 2 games, and has always been outclassed by the barret and other higher power sniper rifles.
And the Dragunov's recoil is moderately high, and unpredictable, has always been. It's hard to get a second shot or more with the Dragunov, unless you go prone to reduce the recoil. Also, the Barret's(same as the PSG1's) recoil settles faster than the Dragunov. While it has a little more recoil than the Drag, it has 2X the recenterspeed ( 1000 vs Dragunov's 500) to make up for it. Like the Drag, the barret will have almost no recoil while going prone, yet it still retains those huge OSOK multipliers to the chest and stomach. With the Dragunov, the only way you can legit snipe with this gun, is go prone like a sitting duck and double tap. Or if you're lucky, go for a neck or headshot at an unsuspecting target, which not only takes time to line up a shot, but the target has to be stationary as well, to get consistent OSOK neck+headshots.
weapon stats can be found at xanga.com/denkirson
http://denkirson.xanga.com/632800688/call-of-duty-4/
http://denkirson.xanga.com/735016527/black-ops/
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmWEaU8N7NeddHNhUlJxZ3RMd1NnVUVDNEt mYUR4SWc#gid=0
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Currently Being ModeratedMar 3, 2012 5:55 AM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
The main problem, as I see it, is the exact same as in the last Medal of Honor.
In previous MW games, stopping power caused the weapons to kill in a maximum of three hits for normal-powered weapons on long range, and two hits on short range.
Their two hit kill damage on short range allowed the semi-automatic snipers, with slower aim speed, to compete.
Now that all assault rifles are low-damage apart from the Burst Fire Rifle We Do Not Mention (and Mk 14 is a battle rifle), and need three hits to kill on short range, semi-auto snipers had to give up something, too.
Easy solution: Give SOME assault rifles and SMGs 1.4 modifiers to chest.
M16, G36C, ACR, AK47 and MP5.
That would let them compete with the semi-auto snipers if they were buffed to one hit kill to upper torso.- Report Abuse
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Currently Being ModeratedMar 4, 2012 7:28 PM (in response to adw1983)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
I think it's pointless to do that.. You're basically rebalancing the entire metagame by doing that, and that's too drastic.
Not all weapons were affected by built in "stopping power" in this game. Just a few, such as the P90, PM9, G36c, M4, ACR, and 4 sniper rifles for instance. However some weapons from previous games were revamped to have significantly different mechanics as well such as differences in RoF, in addition to power as well (P90, UMP, PM9 japanese uzi).
In terms of built in stopping power, I'm mostly troubled by the 4 sniper rifles i mentioned earlier, which happen to be: Barret 50 cal, AS50, L118A, and MSR. Instead of having 70 base damage from previous CoD games, it's now 98. This doesn't really change things on the surface, because these guns still OSOK from the head all the way down to the stomach, like previous strong sniper rifles since COD4.. But this increased damage allows them to OSOK all the way down to the chest w/ a silencer--which I think is pretty powerful, as you're only sacrificing a stomach multiplier--to be off the radar when you shoot.
In previous games:
BO: All sniper rifles could only OSOK to the head and neck w/ a silencer. This actually gave the Dragunov a small niche, because it was even in power with the other sniper rifles a silencer, and had the advantage of largest mag size, fastest reload time, and tied in 1st in fastest swap times with the PSG1. Due to such small OSOK areas, it wasn't popular or nearly as effective to use a silencer then without, in most battles against skilled users.
MW2: Only a few sniper rifles could OSOK all the way down to the chest with a silencer (Intervention, Barret 50 Cal), BUT--it required the Stopping Power perk, which took up the perk 2 slot.
Previous games didn't have silencers on sniper rifles.
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Currently Being ModeratedMar 4, 2012 7:41 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
I think in general, the sniper rifles in this game is the most imbalanced out of the entire franchise, when comparing each sniper rifle in its class to each other and as a whole.
Half of the sniper rifles are completely outclassed and have no real niche whatsoever against their superior counterparts.
1. Barret 50 Cal>AS50
AS50 is a poor man's barret. Same power, same recoil pattern, and same running speed. But a much slower rate of fire (200 Vs 1200 RPM), 2X as smaller mag size (5 Vs 10), which also is outclassed in reload time, in proportion to its mag size--when compared to the Barret. It also has slower Swap times than the Barret as well. The only real niche it has over the Barret, is that it has lower sway from its default scope then the Barret does. But this can be easily migatated, by slapping on an ACOG that reduces sway in half anyway, AND gives the same zoom power as AS50's default zoom (2.4X).
2. MSR>L118A
MSR is a 1.5 version of L118A. Same exact power, recoil pattern, running speed and pretty much the same RoF. BUT, MSR has a faster reload time and weapon swap times. L118A has absolutely NOTHING over the MSR.
3. RSASS>Dragunov
The RSASS is basically like an M21 on steroids. It doesn't have the same recoil pattern as the M21, but it's recoil vaues are comparable.. And yet it boasts twice the mag size. Anyway, back to the subject. Dragunov's only niche over the RSASS, is a faster movement speed. That's it. They share the same power and RoF. RSASS on the other hand, not only has significantly less recoil, but also 2X the mag size, faster reload times, AND faster swap times too!
If the Dragunov retained it's OSOK to the chest in this game like previous games(and OSOK to head and neck w/ silencer), it wouldn't be a useless crap weapon that wouldn't be comparable to the RSASS.It would retain it's middle man status in power from previous games, and might be an okay viable alternative to the high power sniper rifles.- Report Abuse
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Currently Being ModeratedMay 15, 2012 9:21 PM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
I have the golden dragonuv title and im a dragonuv vet and i agree that nerfing the dragonuv is not fair considering the amount of recoil that the gun has compared to any gun in the game pls give the dragonuv more power
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Currently Being ModeratedMay 20, 2012 2:32 AM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
please,please, buff the Dragunov!!!!!!!!!
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Currently Being ModeratedMay 20, 2012 2:39 AM (in response to Arcanine2013)Re: Infinity Ward, please consider patching/un-nerfing the Dragunov in this game to OSOK in the chest w/out silencer + head & neck w/ silencer! Please hear me out!
Dragunov is still better than the pump-action shotguns
Although i do agree it needs some sort of buff- Report Abuse
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