BUMP!

MovinSoSlow18 wrote:

 

schmambuman wrote:

 

DropDragon wrote:

 

+9001

And as an example, WAW-the MP40=Perfect weapon balance and variety

Thanks, I've never had over 9000 before.
And yeah, the MP40 was kinda what I was going for. Nerfing that gun would have no effect on the variety of the other guns at all.

Are you kidding me...Did you even play world at war?

Yeah. Are you saying that the MP40 was essential to the balance of WAW and that nerfing it would create a game paradox where time has no meaning and all guns are suddenly the same?

ficko88 wrote:

 

DropDragon wrote:

 

+9001

It's over nine thousand!

Nappa! Do as I say!

IrishK wrote:

 

The balance in this game is atrocious - there is no variety. Most weapons use the same damage (35/40 to 30/25 for assault rifles), rate of fire (937.5 and 750) and recoil values - the only difference being reload times and other trivial details. All weapon categories have one that is a clear winner over every other.

You can have balanced weapons and variety between them. There are LOTS of ways to do this. So don't be fooled for one second thinking that you cannot have good balance and variety.

http://denkirson.xanga.com/735016527/black-ops/

The MAC-11, PM63, Spectre and Kiparis are almost IDENTICAL in EVERY way. You call that balance? C'mon, people...

Are you talking about me? I'm arguing for balance and variety at the same time.

WhiteHawk0117 wrote:

 

Lol at the Bumps.

What the Op came up with is the more basic way of doing weapons.  CoD4 does this very well.

Also, I would like to extend this to different types of weapons, to show that weapons are different by more then just name.

Assault Rifles = All Range weapons with the main criteria given by the OP
SMGs = Fast ROF, Low Range
LMG = Large Ammo Count, Slow Reload
Snipers = High Damage, Slow ROF, Low Mags, Long Range (Mostly)
Shotguns = High Damage, Low Range, Moderate Reload, Small Ammo Capactity

This is true, although all the weapons do not really have to follow these suits. The AUG H-BAR didn't really follow suit with all the other LMGs, and it still felt like an LMG to me. Besides, all SMGs don't really need a fast fire rate, they just need high damage output up close.

Anyone else have any opinions or counterarguments as to how balance is not possible without making all weapons the exact same? Because people seem to have the idea that if there isn't a god gun, somehow all other guns are the same.

An Oreo wrote:

 

schmambuman wrote:

 

DropDragon wrote:

 

+9001

And as an example, WAW-the MP40=Perfect weapon balance and variety

Thanks, I've never had over 9000 before.
And yeah, the MP40 was kinda what I was going for. Nerfing that gun would have no effect on the variety of the other guns at all.

Yeah, it would affect it. Not that many people want low RoF+high damaged guns. If the MP40 was balanced, people wouldn't use it.

I'm not sure what you mean. Most people gravitate towards the high damage guns anyways, if the MP40 was balanced, and still had high damage, but perhaps had its hipfire nerfed or something, how would that affect every single other gun in the game? Besides, wouldn't that be better?

An Oreo wrote:

 

schmambuman wrote:

 

And as an example, WAW-the MP40=Perfect weapon balance and variety

Thanks, I've never had over 9000 before.
And yeah, the MP40 was kinda what I was going for. Nerfing that gun would have no effect on the variety of the other guns at all.

Yeah, it would affect it. Not that many people want low RoF+high damaged guns. If the MP40 was balanced, people wouldn't use it.[/quote]

I'm not sure what you mean. Most people gravitate towards the high damage guns anyways, if the MP40 was balanced, and still had high damage, but perhaps had its hipfire nerfed or something, how would that affect every single other gun in the game? Besides, wouldn't that be better?[/quote]


No matter the weapon, as long as it is overpowered, people will use it for that reason alone. As a result, other great weapons such as the DP28 and the BAR get ignored. Not to mention, the DP28 and BAR are both low RoF, high damaged weapons. Nobody wants a balanced MG, people want the overpowered SMG. This, in turn, caused people to get turned off. Getting killed many times with the same gun made the game boring. Go onto MW2, the weapons are slightly less unbalanced, but many more weapons are considered "OP", but many guns were affected by this, allowing you to pick a weapon. Nothing beat M16 noobs with an ACR, and it was always fun destroying UMP rushers with an M21. Now that people weren't restricted to one or 2 overpowered weapons, it allowed for more variety and making the game more fun.

The day I got killed by the DP28 for the first time, I almost fainted.[/quote]

I think you are essentially saying the same thing I am though, that it would indeed be better if the OP guns were brought down. After all, if every single gun is OP, isn't that what balance is? I would rather there be a bunch of OP weapons, and only a few UP ones, than a single OP gun, and a bunch of UP ones. Is this what you're trying to say?

MatadorRED wrote:

 

I think if they change the classes, it's like programming a whole new game, you know what I mean? lol

They messed up on SMGs. If they made them better, you would see people use SMGs as frequently as AR, like in Modern Warfare 2.
The shotguns are balanced, but the maps don't provide an environment suitable for people rushing with a shotty.
The debate on snipers speaks for itself.
LMGs are good, I can't complain. Except for the useless DUAL MAG attachment on RPK that actually doesn't increase ammo.

There are so many new things they added, like Flamethrower, Decoy, Nova Gas, but they just didn't make it worthwhile to use. I know good players use Nova Gas for Domination, but good players run Tactical Mask on Dom too.

I know what you mean, but I saw a lot more variety in MW2 too. I saw a bunch of people using snipers, LMGs, SMGs, Semi auto ARs, Burst fire ARs, I saw some really good players even with guns like the F2000. In Black ops, it just seems like the only guns are the FAMAS and 74u, sometimes I see a stoner or two, but it's rather dissapointing, as there are so many other guns to use. Just look at your combat record. I'm not complaining that the weapons can't be used, that's just not true, I've gotten some really good gameplay with the Stakeout, in fact, my first flawless game with 40 kills was with the stakeout on jungle. I think there isn't enough distinction between different guns. Mainly the fact that there are only 2 fire rates, combined with the massive amount of similarities between certain guns, it's quite infuriating.